Give me one reason why fascist is my enemy and not just retarded comrade in struggle against porkies

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So you are using the anfem flag ironically.

You do not understand leftism in the slightest if you think soviet-esque countries were "a serious attempt at putting [our] ideology into practice". For this argument to hold water you need to prove that those countries reflected what leftists actually believe

Also it is a fact that the nazis were economically illiterate. Nazi germany was built on deficit spending and they attempted to make up for it by pillaging Europe.

t. adolf hitler

Fascists have always been allied with capitalists, they just pretend to hate some of them.

Wrong.

gowans.wordpress.com/2012/12/21/do-publicly-owned-planned-economies-work/

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Classic.

They demand heirarchy, say that there is a natural order of master and slave, fiercely protect the nuclear family and want to kill anyone who dares be different from them.

How can such an objectively simple and rational set of economics be so hard to put into practice? If "the economics" is on your side, how has every country in history that has tried to adjust to a communist economy failed so badly?

Will there be any point where you seriously reconsider your beliefs, or just double down on the "every successful communist revolutionary was a complete fucking mong, but they'll eventually get it right in the next revolution" line?

I'd certainly enjoying seeing Holla Forumsyps in forced labor camps

Holla Forums just wants to flood your country with nigger and turn you into a slave producing goods for their enjoyment.

Did the successful communist revolutionaries have no understanding of the economics on which they were basing their revolution as well?

Why should I - or anyone else - follow an ideology where even its successful adherents apparently don't understand it sufficiently well to implement it successfully?

this is why marxists get shot, no one wants to be a slave for an international order.

they did though

Isn't is a school night? I think you should go do your English homework kiddo because you're borderline illiterate.

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If typos make you mad i wonder what bullets would do.

Hi Holla Forums

For the record, I've worked manual labor jobs with black people before, and goddamn if they didn't work their asses off. We weren't paid a penny above minimum wage, but it didn't stop them from busting their backs every day they worked.

Those graphs weren't based on the erroneous CIA estimates that assumed the Soviets must've had a stronger economy if they could sustain the comparatively-larger military build-up compared to the US, right?

Probably be effectively loaded into a gun by someone who isn't an invalid or child soldier.

Reactionaries are monarchists. Not all nationalists are monarchists.

but you do want to be slaves to your rich masters, bosses and arbitrary lines on a map it seems.

I'm just your standard Marxist, so I expect to just have to do a bit of shit kicking when capitalism collapses on its own accord, rather than actively plot to undermine it until it starts to collapse around me. It's a political theory rather than an ideology, with many ideologies based on it. Many, if not all of the problems facing a state set up under such circumstances won't have the problems the USSR and PRC faced from the beginning and throughout.

Just like your Comrade Khrushchev once said, if you don't where our borders are then we will show you.

nice fucking meme lad

please demonstrate to me that those countries did not have wage slavery, and that workers owned the means of production in those countries, or kindly fuck off

maybe if you keep saying it enough times, somebody will actually believe it

No

It's from Farm to Factory: A Reinterpretation of the Soviet Industrial Revolution, by Robert C. Allen.

The Soviets only started plowing tons of money into the military after 1970, coincidentally around the time that growth slowed

From 1928 (first Five Year Plan) to the 1970s, growth was rapid and consistent. No recessions, unlike capitalism.

Here's something i noticed, every time i say it none of you refute it and some of you even agree with it.

See

Because you're retarded and not even putting forth an argument.

"muh niggers" is your pet issue fam

we don't give a shit

They could be short term allies sure, a good tool for overthrowing the current order, kind of like the Three Kingdoms Period in China.

the KPD tried that in the 1930s

"first Hitler, then our turn"

didn't end too well

That's because they didn't do enough to eliminate the liberals that eventually backed Hitler.

Who to believe the ones that think i am in school, the ones who think i am a dumb racist labourer or the ones that think i am just plain retarded.

One of them is half right i do plenty of labouring and know well not to trust internationalists who would happily flood the country with millions of Chang or Mbutu and kill off the value of my labour for good while our new diversity rapes and murders the working poor on the streets.

You're either thick as shit or you're trolling. Do you even know what facism is? It's designed explictly to REINFORCE class divisions through the belief that society needs a caste system to effectively function.

You are the cancer killing this board.

Lets just say fascist are the ultimate good goyims for the porkies. They love to lick somebodys boots.

Then y'all've got a lot of purging to do on this board Methinks.

Chang built the fucking railroads

Mbutu grew the food

Jose built the houses

Squanto made the clothes

All to keep your ancestors from having to

What did you do?

>>>/reddit/

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thanks for the reading recommendation

I am a person who was more or less convinced by the fascist narrative promulgated by Holla Forums until relatively recently. The feeling of being manipulated and dispossessed, of being taken advantage of for your work, of being exploited for the sake of some elite's agenda is, I really believe, what drives the contemporary person to fascism. In this sense, the fascist feels like the leftist does. He feels deep down that something is wrong, that he isn't getting due acknowledgment for his contributions and talents and that he is being exploited. The difference is, he interprets the cause of these feelings to be Jews and immigrants and feminism. He is still thinking within the terms of hierarchy, believing that if there weren't all these others eroding and leeching off the natural hierarchy, if they could just be gotten rid of, he would regain his natural place in the hierarchy.

What I think leftists need to do to persuade those toying with fascism or on the fence, or even full-blown converts, is to show them that the hierarchy of capitalism doesn't operate according to racial lines, or lines of sexuality and gender, and that even if they got their most extreme genocidal wishes they would still be the exploited proletariat on the other end. The hierarchy they imagine is natural and from which they have been dispossessed is not a hierarchy of race at all. For me, as soon as I was able to frame those feelings in terms of exploitation at the hands of capitalism, the resentment of jews and other immigrants dissipated. I immediately felt solidarity with those whom I had just days before blamed and despised.

It's something of an existential shift, where the field through which you see all phenomena changes in an instant, and all of a sudden the phenomena themselves mean different things.

I guess what I'm saying is that I think it's the present material conditions and feelings of disillusionment that have driven people to fascism. I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with most of them. They're just people, and fascism offers a totalizing narrative that from the inside seems to make perfect sense. Be patient with them. Try to reason with them on their own terms (perhaps not on Holla Forums–you get banned pretty quickly). Arguing with them from outside of their worldview will basically get you nowhere. If you can channel their energies, feelings, and beliefs from within their worldview, though, you might be able to spur them into class consciousness and break the fascist spell. It happened to me.

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Not an argument tbqh

We should exploit fascists the same way porky exploits the international proletariat

Wasn't an invitation to debate, it was an invitation to leave.

Sorry your brand of politics has created a place with two or three posts per thread and it's continued to elude you that the two are connected.

Good post

This is a good post, I was going to say something like it but couldn't phrase it better than "this thread is full of autistic ideologues roleplaying" and gave up.

What was the post that won you over? Or did you just read some stuff and come to a conclusion on your own?

The USSR achieved, for varying lengths of time, all 'ten planks of communism' as laid out by Marx.

That's an immediate program, not actual Communism.

Fascism purposely imitates leftism. But it's made to uphold class society. Even the most "radical" of them essentially just want heavily-regulated homogeneous capitalism in which people with too much money get executed alongside the unemployed but the structures out of which poverty and wealth develop are not eliminated. They're all actually horrible.

Because their point is to subvert.

All of these retards saying Fascists are just puppets of Porky. That's why Stalin had to team up with Porky to kill the Fascists

You cannot have nationalism today in any sort of form, simply because, it doesn't work. And not only does it not work, it increases racial tensions and confirms a narrative to the uneducated that we are all in fact, individuals fighting one another. And in this, we are all individuals fighting either for "our people" against "their people". And in a society where economies are all doomed to failure without cooperation on a mass scale, the challenge of Nationalism then becomes how to be less and less Nationalistic, and more and more sympathetic to inner power structures it promised to fight. Because if you are a gung ho nationalist, it follows, you are promising your nation will collapse in on itself economically and politically, not just that, but also socially. Racial tensions rise and so do hatreds not seen for some time, all working to divide the labor class, the lack of opportunity the public thought it had with nationalism collapses, and they vote in another liberal, the cycle begins again etc.

What is dangerous about this, is we are headed into uncertain times, times where global warming and climate change will effect the world on a global scale, from agriculture to quality of life, and I'm afraid the public will become more and more angry at scapegoats than it will the problem it always had. This problem that has no name, this problem who you cannot say is really a problem.

Capitalism.

And a solution you can't really say either

Political mobility of the left and collectivism.

Nationalism really means the opposite, it means the growth of contradictory Capital and the decline of the nation faster.

But nonetheless Nationalism will become popular for the following reasons.

But do you know what Nationalism solves? None of it, really. It makes all these problems worse.

Clinging to nationalism is a disbelief at the loss of power. Not of economic power we have over the state, but of a false sense of rugged individualism stripped; not of anything factual, but everything of fear.

In the 30's mass panic occurred when not the Nazis or Russians invaded the US, but of all things, the Martians, in a radio broadcast by Orson Welles of the novel War of the Worlds.

Something similar is happening now, but with vast dire political and economic consequences.

The United States will cease being a world leader in less than 25 years and nationalism for its empty patriotism will be the final nail in its coffin.

So goes the United States, so goes the world as we know it, in comes a new model, either frightening or better. It depends how optimistic you are.

That is why we cannot support fascists and nationalists. They cannot solve the same problems we do, even if they say they will.

Marx is not talking about Communism as such, but is describing some examples of his 'dialectical materialism' which would be present in advanced societies, even capitalist ones, at the time. Notice he says in one of the prefaces to the Manifesto 'The practical application of the principles will depend, as the Manifesto itself states, everywhere and at all times, on the historical conditions for the time being existing, and, for that reason, no special stress is laid on the revolutionary measures proposed at the end of Section II' to which he is only referring to of course that infamous 10 'planks'. I mean, look, you can even see it in burger country: criminalgovernment.com/docs/planks.html

It is absurd to think that we can, by mere description, achieve something as immanent as Marx so his mistress Communism.

How can they be comrades in the struggle against porky when they don't fight against porky? I don't understand this meme that seriously takes the fascists' claim to be "third-way"

It's all propaganda from the internet fascist/nationalist wave. I don't understand why they can be sometimes so read politically and not understand what they're trying for is doomed to rip apart a doomed nation even faster.

And for the accelerationists among us, that could be good.

It could also be tremendously bad.

laid out in the context of germany in 1848 (which was before the unification)