Literally the only thing that makes this game difficult is losing all souls when dying twice

what ambushes and traps

what do you propose you lose instead? the player needs to actively be punished for their mistakes to keep them more engaged, if you just revert to a checkpoint less than five minutes ago most players will simply brute force their way through the game eventually and won't provide much gratification ultimately

of course there is a point where losing too much progress is simply annoying, but i would argue that in the souls games, for the most part, the distance between bonfires is not too extreme

The only difficulty in DS is getting used to actually dying and losing shit without being able to quickload. Modern gamers aren't used to that sort of gameplay anymore.

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Does that mean the game is bad?

yeah, most games don't

I don't know, I'm not a masochist cuck like you.

Nah. RE4 allows you to retry an area as many times as you want and I'm still engaged.

Design wise, the game was decent I guess, even though some areas are shit. The combat is functional, I like how it's not a hack and slash crap where you have to slice a weak enemy 100 times to kill them like most jap shits out there.

What makes it difficult is the undearable NeoGAF infested fanbase.

Also the boredom, shit framerate, glitches and trial and error.

if only the game wasn't so fucking boring

oh wow bosses that have huge health bars
amazing and half the bosses i can't even parry, amazing.

WEW

this

When people say Souls games are not hard they're not just meming. Souls games are are not really all that difficult, they simply punish the player for losing or acting stupid. There are plenty of NES era games which are actually difficult to beat- that is, they take more than patience and perseverance to beat; they take a lot of skill. Souls games do require a fair amount of skill but primarily it is about acting smart, and not acting skilfully. This is why people call them "hard but fair". Actually difficult games border into the territory of unfairly balanced gameplay.

The boss fights are gay, I had more fun fighting common enemies that carry sword and shield most of the time.

By what standard?

Why do people here like being punished very woefully so much? It's either autism or a form of extreme masochism.

It's enjoying overcoming the obstacle, obviously. You sound like a retard that got butthurt after getting your shit slapped in Undeadburg and never overcame any real challenge the game threw at you.

Question
Would it be possible to have a musou game in the souls universe?

no because musous kinda suck

Because it makes it more fun once you actually overcome the obstacles and have reached your goal.

Undead Burg was easy, but beyond that I used cheat engine. I've finished the game though.

Gives you pretense of your own skill maybe, like "OMG I was MLG af", not actual fun. Just fulfilling, egoistically fulfilling.

there is no trial and error in Dark Souls 1
maybe if you are playing on consoles because the PC version has a framerate unlocking mod that literally fixes all framerate issues in the game, especially Blighttown
There are glitches in the game yes
I can't fix shit taste

If there is no threat of loss, than there is no joy in victory.

There was a time when we didn't have "press x to win" games kiddo.

Yeah
Especially when you vome to kill Seath and he is unbeatable
And you come back and he is still unbeatable
And what you actually need to do is walk over invisible roads over a giant cave, he will be there for some reason now

Or that you know absolutely nothing of the enemies you are about to face until it's too late
You won't know that you need an anti-magic shit for four kings until you are already there and fucked
Every fucking boss works that way, you can't prepare for them since the game doesn't tell you shit about them before throwing you into the fight.

Y'all posting in a bait thread.

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LOL
O
L

What makes a game fun in your opinion then?

alright, I'll take it
Well if you didn't have the attention span of a squirrel, you'd have known that the game gives you plenty of hints that foreshadow his invincibility, like the Lady of the Darkling's warning, Big Hat Logan's explanation, as well as the opening cinematic.
So you're saying you thought it'd be a good idea to try and brute force the boss that just insta-killed you without taking the time to explore the area and find some answers?
I know you're retarded, but even you can hide behind a shield.
You don't need an anti-magic shit for Four Kings. You just need to git gud. Learn their moves and dodge accordingly. The AoE attacks and the grab attacks are bullshit, fair enough, but you can dodge the rest of their attacks without magic buffs just fine.
So you expect a fucking Pokedex to just pop up and say, "HEY THIS IS WHAT THE BOSS IS WEAK AGAINST"? That's fucking gay, and just because the game doesn't do this doesn't mean that bosses are trial and error. The majority of them are weak to standard melee attacks. It isn't fucking brain surgery. Use your weapon and don't let them hit you. The exceptions who are specifically weak to some element, buff or strategy can still be beaten using conventional sword and board or dodging and R1 spam.

I'll take the bait and recommend you try out Biocuck and Fable 2 then.

I actually completely forgot about that one moment in the game with Seath. I'm almost 99% sure you are intended to die there because you respawn in a jail cell. Even then you can still go back collect your souls and then leave the fog or Homeward Bone out

That's sounds like what Rich Evans recently said about Dishonored 2. Essentially, since stealth is optional there is no threat of losing anything by abandoning stealth tactics thus no tension.

IMO when you are permitted to fail an unlimited number of times with little or no punishment the game has to be very challenging to compensate. I never played Super Meat Boy, but I hear it's like that.

Super Meat Boy is exactly like that. It forces you to master the controls. Death is meaningless but you won't get anywhere if you either play too safe or too aggressive.

Here is what happened when I first came to Seath:
I came in, he did his crystal shit so I got my shield up. Only took a small fraction of my health, and since I had 20 estus at this point it was no problem. So, I shoot the fucker with a bow and his health just goes back in a second. So, I walk around the whole area thinking that I need to destroy some item to defeat him and it just isn't there. So, what I was supposed to do is to die, leave all my souls there, and go in a COMPLETELY DIFFERENT DIRECTION to defeat that boss who is still sitting in the same room if you decide to return.
If you are talking about warnings than pretty much every creature in that game is an unbeatable immortal warrior that is three times as tall as you.

I would like some indication of things that are about to happen before they happen, yes. I would enjoy if a drake didn't burn me to death with no warning after I just beat the taurus demon. I would enjoy if the stone in Sen's fortress stopped rolling after I kill the giant and reroute the stone to a hole in the wall, but nope. I would like to hear about the furniture in the library not breaking from a roll like the rest before I am running from two archers. I would also like to know about the shitty frogs in catacombs tearing half your health off with their weak as fuck attacks before I meet them. And no, a fucking randomised loading screen is not a solution, especially since these go by in a flash. The game expects you to die to the enemy multiple times before you beat them while also implementing a system that heavily punishes you for dying.

Also "learn their moves" is the dumbest fucking shit from soulsfags I keep hearing when they claim the game isn't trial and error. You are seeing their moves for the first time, you have no idea that this golem will just throw you away like a fucking ragdoll and kill you in one hit. There is also that great idea of keeping close to a spider woman armed with a giant sword being the best stratedy against her, even though she keeps using melee attacks. Or the asulum fuck being able to explode everything around him, even though the previous fuck couldn't.

The sole reason dark souls was crap compared to demons souls is that you could simply out run anything you didn't feel like dealing with.

In demons souls they chase you down and fucking slay you.

Well, the world design in Dark Souls is different than Demon Souls. DeS has a very point A to point B design, with all the stages being obstacle courses to the boss. However, DaS is more Metroid-like in its design, with the areas very inter-connected and many directions to go at once. With a world that's more focused on exploration than anything else, having to fight every individual enemy you come across becomes tedious.

casul

xDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD

Good lord, just shoot yourself you casual idiot

Read messages on the floor/wiki dipshit

There were no messages on the floor on my version.

That's not really an working argument. The wiki is information from outside the game, and is exactly the same principle as reading or watching a walkthrough. Messages on the floor require at least one person to do the thing blind, plus won't be there if a player is offline or when the servers eventually go down.

Literally

Git

Gud

Like

Ugh

So

Hard

LOL

Dark Souls sucks ass, get over it

Literally the only thing that makes this game difficult is Bed of Chaos

Because getting back up after dying with no consequence isn't a loss. It's a setback.

Dark Souls games are only as hard as you want them to be

ahaha no

nice meme

There are plenty of games that are just as difficult. Souls games just have shitty hitboxes and waste your time after every death.
Just give me a 2 minute loading screen so I can go take a piss and get a drink.

Good game. Terrible death mechanic that just wastes time.
I've never thought restarting a level on death was fun. I've never finished a mario game. I've only ever been motivated to replay a level dozens of times when there is some kind of reward/ranking system like gold/perfecting a level. I enjoy Trials games where there is a reason to replay the level to do it perfectly. When I just have to get to some boss that will one-shot me at the end, it's a complete waste of time for me. Sure, it's punishing and "hardcore gamers" will defend it, but it's a total waste of time in my eyes.
I got about halfway through Demon's Souls and killed maybe 2 bosses in Dark Souls and I was done with the series. The gameplay and aesthetics are neat, but not good enough for me to invest hours for that payoff people play this game for. I don't personally value that rush of victory in a fucking video game as worth the hours of frustration dying to bosses. I did when I was a kid, but I'm an adult with limited free time now.

I would rather practice a sport for hours and get the payoff of winning with the bonus of improving my health. Playing difficult games for some payoff at the end when I finally beat it has lost all appeal to me in my old age. I would play Souls games if I could restart right at the boss.
Yes I am.
Each hour I spend running back to the boss is one hour I'm not even playing the game. A complete waste of time. Artificially padding the game and inflating the "difficulty".

This shit right here is happening because we tolerate fucking casuals on our board who think VNs are difficult and buy AAA releases they see at E3. This is why we currently have Overwatch generals, and had Undertale generals, because of these niggers who can only handle that level of "difficulty". If these faggots were to step back for a second, they'd realize they are what ruined this industry.

Difficult games are easy to understand. You get fucked up, you get punished. You quit because of the punishment? You don't deserve the sense of catharsis when you beat the fucker.

Get off of Holla Forums you fucking normalfag

WEW

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Don't the Japanese design games with the intent of selling strategy guides and gaming magazines? Wonder how that has worked out with the advent of wikis. Do the Japanese themselves use wikis or do they prefer to buy a physical book?

Not all games have to be difficult in order to be good.

and not all difficult games are good, but there are people claiming ITT like
that difficult games by their nature are bad

casual detected

If you think that's a problem then don't ever touch Dark Souls II.

Ring of Sacrifice.

Only difficulty was because of huge spike in difficulty during beginning of the game.
After I gargoyles I killed most bosses in both DaS1 and Das2 at first or second try.

This is what really makes you casual. Always when I played something difficult I didn't done it for any pay-off, I just enjoyed a challenge.

It was actually quite annoying. You just ran through enemies to get to the boss.
I mean you could fight just for the joy of killing things but it was negated by the fact you would drop any souls you have gotten before boss on each failed boss attempt.

There is one, it is called Scholar of the First Sin.

Got DS1 a few weeks ago and i still can't beat gwyn. Should i just try parrying more? I don't understand why i'm having difficulty here, i beat dmc3's dmd with no issues.

I used the black iron greatshield, forgot the name but its the one with massive fire resistance. Parrying just makes gwyn a total easy modo joke

When he does the two-handed overhead swing, dodge the first one then parry the second swing. Use any items that have good physical/fire defense

Alright i'll give it another go, thanks guys!

No prob man, you got this

Don't ruin the fight for yourself, mang!

There is only one trial and error element in Dark Souls 1 and it goes away after the very first time, is Bed of Chaos, I assume the anti-magic thing he means is the art of Abyss Walking.

This has gotta be a world record for projecting
By the standards set by children, I guess
Stop being such a whiny bitch and learn how to play the game already

Can't you try winning at life instead? It's just a video game bro, I just wanna have some fun while slacking off.

Animation, sound design, mechanics, etc. Challenge doesn't matter much to me, as long as it isn't baby tier easy.

Take a chill pill dude.

Hey, why don't you reserve that for something more important. It's just a video game, nothing is painful, just tedious.

Are you the guy who was complaining about getting invaded and losing 40k souls yesterday.

just stick to party games lmao

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Bed of chaos was not difficult at all.

I beat it in two tries. Which is hilarious because it actually fucking saved my progress from the first attempt.

I don't think you understand what a hobby is.

Fuck op I have a question!

I'm stuck on Smough and and oy vey Orenstein. I'm using the black knight great sword and getting my boy pussy wrecked. Any advice besides summoning a nonshitter or Jolly Cooperation? BKGS is slow as fuck and I ultimately get shitcanned should I survive the second form of either.

Use quicker armour, improve your weapon, keep trying. aka git gud.

It's why the shield is basically mandatory for most characters you build and why players have been able to just beat the game using just a shield.

Backpedal like crazy and use the pillars to try and separate the two of them. Ornstein and Smough are individually easy to deal with.
Don't bother blocking. Ornstein deals Lightning damage and Smough hits too hard for blocking to be viable in that fight.
Don't get greedy, either. If you're using a heavy/slow weapon, don't bother attacking more than once per opportunity. You might be able to stagger Ornstein, I can't remember if he can be, but Smough probably won't give a shit and will just wind up an attack in your face.

Even fucking minecraft has this.

Take down Smough first since his attacks are slow, 2nd half is easier with just Ornstein

It's autism and panders greatly to the autists in this realm.

take your meds

id say in the same vein "plenty of nes games" are just very punishing. games that would often send you back to the very beginning of the game and didnt have many if any check points in individual levels.

DS2 was better than DS3. I will debate this with anyone.

Please leave Holla Forums since you have no clue about video games. Go back to cuckchan.

Most people played it on consoles and the game is unplayable on PC without fan mods. What do we validate, From Software's work or Durante's? Because From Software's work is abysmal. And even with the mod the game runs like shit on PC at times, just played it with my R9 295x a few days ago.

Too bad you also can't fix repetitive gameplay.

Now back to NeoGAF or cuckchan with you, those kids love this franchise.

Cool. This is DS2. It's not DS3.

DS3 is better. I won.

Nice debate.

It's not a good game in literally any way, though.

Your complaint is legit,t hough.

Too bad the more casual Holla Forums becomes, the more Souls cock suckers and NeoGAF tourists we get here. I still remember back then we basically never even had Souls threads.

You haven't explained how Dark Souls 1 has trial and error though. You just keep on saying it does.

thats what it did for all of us retard

Because back then we were having Bloodborne threads.

Because it's mind-boggling and a waste of time. About every game has trial and error. Whether this is a bad thing or tolerable depends on the execution, like how bad is the punishment or how few the tells.

That's because only the legally retarded think this game is difficult

He doesn't want to have to explain it, but the trial and error comes from having to figure out enemy movesets which is piss easy if you use a good shield, which ones you can parry/ riposte along with ones you can parry but not riposte, what the timing for a successful parry is, figuring out circle-strafing to get a backstab works on virtually all nonboss enemies, navigating places like Blighttown, and how bosses work in general.

I sense your definition of trial and error is very broad, similar to your definition of repetitive gameplay. Next you will be telling me playing games is a waste of time

Yours is, probably because you're retarded, otherwise you wouldn't a) unironically believe there "is no trial and error in Souls 1" and b) even bring up "defintion" since the definition of trial and error is trial and error, only a retard cannot unerstand this. I.e. you.

But to give you an easy example.

They didn't.
most of them never heard about them anyway and if you'd show them a couple old, actually hard games, they'd just close their eyes in fear of getting eyecvancer or some bullshit "argument".

git gud

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I used a fire uchi and black knight shield (100% phys, 95% fire) for some fucking reason gwyn is weak to fire

well said

If thats the only thing making it difficult then just don't die. Shouldn't be hard considering everything else is easy.

Holy fucking christ, kill yourself underageb&

Summon solaire and let him kill Smough while you keep ornstein busy.
In the second stage you can either get lucky and kill ornstein with solaire alive or you'll just have to use the good ol' juke and jive to get your hits in.
If you have a ranged build the boss is pretty much a joke because you can get ornstein stuck behind a pillar.

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