Why do commies push this "stupid military mistake" meme for the Nazis?

Have you ever played Command and Conquer: Red Alert? Don't you realize that Germany's "suicide" tactic was the only thing that kept Communism outside of Western Europe for 50 years?

What was his war machine?

The only mistake they made was leaving jews alive.

When I got to the chapters in Hitler's Revolution about betrayal and treason by former aristocrats (especially in Germany's secret intelligence services) I was fucking sick to my stomach. Traitors had a significant impact on the war, even in such early on matters as getting fascist Spain into the war effort

someone i was speaking to attacked me the other day and basically tried to pick a fight with me because im a natsoc. I found it extremely unsettling that someone would challenge me on a forum in defense of soviets. he tried to say germans were subhuman compared to the soviets. he kept saying something about germany having a vampire economy. this was in a room almost exclusively for natsocs too. he had examples and stats on hand and anti German images. he even went so far as to mock the bombing of Dresden saying it was justified. the icing on the cake was when he had the audacity to use a squeaky jewish voice to make fun of me for being a national socialist. " oy veyy da poor germans" etc…

I'm guessing by the fact that you didn't recognize a nazbol-posing shill, and were mad enough about it to talk about it here, that you need to move past internet arguments and start working on it IRL. Those guys only exist as provocative caricatures and consider natsoc posters to be the same thing.

Some of the claims are, dubious, to say the least. Just as the normalfags and generals blaming everything on some magical "incompetence" on the part of Hitler and some advisers after the war seems dubious it is important to remember that revisionists(correct in general or not) are wont to pin the failure on infighting or aristocrats. And those same aristocrats and Speer appear to have openly lied about sabotage in order to avoid facing charges, effectively they disavowed the activities and alligiance by claiming they worked against their government in secret after the war was over, despite there being zero evidence of any such activity other than their claims. Most famously Speer claiming he tried to assassinate Hitler despite there being precisely zero evidence of this having ever occurred and no corroboration.

hooktube.com/watch?v=FlAjAeJBYv4
21:13

Some lefties subconsciously realize Holla Forums is 100% right, but they're so far brainwashed they can't admit it to themselves. It shows through things like what you describe. Another example is when sjws accuse you of being "triggered".

Somewhere in this documentary, the man corroborates that the generals lacked respect for him due to his rank.
youtube.com/watch?v=kHtbKUTC4Qs

OP is a phaggot.webm

It took 4 empires. The French had the second largest in the world. What a humiliating victory.

This TBH. "Nobility" is a code word for cryptokikes and good goys.

Living in an inhospitable wasteland and having no standard for infrastructure so that all your railways are different sizes and you have no roads to speak of making it impossible to invade your country in any kind of efficient way.

me

Chelyabinsk. Also known as "Tankograde" or "tank factory city".

*Tankograd

Why do Leftists feel the need to shit on anything and everything that's not them?

Because every other position, every event in history and every person that wasn't "one of theirs" needs to be taken down, destroyed, ridiculed and forgotten. Everything good: Left. Everything bad: Not Left.

It's as simple as that. You CAN NOT find a Leftie who will agree that Hitler or any of his generals did anything militarily worthwhile.

The only recording we have of Hitler's voice not giving a speech talks about how he was surprised by the amount of tanks Stalin had.

How are nazbols our friends? They are national Bolsheviks, meaning they're part communists, part nationalists. No communist is an ally.

This is a lefty/pol/ shill. He will be banned when the mods see him doing this. Nazbol exists exclusively to cause break us up, and promotes bolshevism which is entirely Jewish. Its anti-nationalist and anti-white.

Yeah it's pretty common, because Germany's economic recovery and growth was nothing short of miraculous, in order to claim that NatSoz is a flawed ideology in spite of that, they claim that the German economy was on the brink of collapse and needed to invade and plunder other nations to keep going.

I'm a fascist and I do this but k.

Having your debt forgiven then stealing belongings to melt into gold and slave labor is indeed a gods gift.

t. Richard Spencer

National Socialism isnt fascism.
t. Goebbels on multiple occasions

Exactly. You're our enemy.

Take a look in the bottom right corner and maybe at the front page where it says you must read Mein Kampf before you post here, among other. We are National Socialists. We are Hitlerites. Nazbol will get you the same thing Strasser got, shot and left to bleed out in his cell for treason. Thats the future of people like you. Shot and left to bleed out and contemplate your treason before you die, if youre lucky enough to be put in prison first.

Hitlerites and MAGApedes, truly a force to be reckoned with. I'm not a NazBol, I'm a realist.

Have some stats too, before Germany plundered Poland of its wealth. Now all that gold in America is being used to fund our replacement, oops, way to go.

Youre a shill, and youre going to be banned when the mods wake up.

Sure thing bud. Youre openly hostile to supporters of Hitler, are promoting white genocide by duginism/nazbol, and you think youre going to be posting here on anything but a vpn after this.

You don't deserve those digits.

Have you ever played Axis and Allies? Don't you realize that pulling out of Russia, going on the defensive and invading Africa is the only way to win?

The only game where I was more excited for more railway workers than Tiger tanks tbh

The only reason Russia won is because the US saved them from their death throws by providing equipment and funding. Without the US the Germans would have won.

Posts like this remind me how far 8/pol/ has fallen.

Based America

yeah and all you weeb faggots can self immolate for all i care, if the japs would have even threatened an invasion of siberia moscow would have fell. the soviets were able to bring massive reinforcements from the far east because the japs are subhuman and a terrible ally. FUCK NIPS.>>10876007

Pulled out because you attacked Poland xD btfo

Yeah based freemason Roosevelt helped based freemason Stalin in his time of need

Stalin was a Georgian kike

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The problem with that was there was amoung the ranking generals and officers who were saboteurs. A lot of operations either failed or barely suceeded because those reporting on the field would have their information withheld by the intelligence below high command. One attack on Stalingrad was example of this: they had their forces ready for the assault, but then some strange order would come in to split the forces between south and north leaving their flanks exposed.

Many members from aristocratic status became disgruntle by Hitler and the fact that regular laborers and farm folks were able to get the same education regardless of social status, and even surpass them in rank, so those same disgruntled aristocrats who did entered the ranks would later form an Resistance group hoping to overthrow Hitler by passing information to the allies, sabotaging military operations, giving misdirections, withholding information and reports on the field from command, sabotaging shipment of supplies and reinforcements, etc. They actively worked towards the defeat of Germany throughout the entire time.

Always kill a traitor before the enemy.

You're just an impressionable moron. You should've shut them down the second they started kvetching.

Except it had already collapsed before they came to power, and they completely turned it around long before war was ever declared. It was a country in a worse depression than the US, and they ended up becoming the most powerful economy in Europe through NatSoc economics alone. Its not like they achieved zero unemployment in the 40s or something. That was pretty soon after them coming to power.

OH and I can't believe I forgot this one.
You know why Fascist Spain chose to be neutral at the time? Hitler wanted to have Spain join the war so they can use its coast to attack Britain's overseas shipments, thus crippling Britain and putting them in a position of surrender. So he gave this proposal to chief named Canaris. Canaris, part of the Resistance group told Franco instead that Germany is fixed in a losing war, and so it'll be safer for Spain to become neutral.

To think Germany could've ended the war far sooner, but a bunch of fucking upset pricks would fuck things up early on.

the reason brits and french let hitler build up germany was because they counted on using him to take out the soviet union and then just invade germany again, but when the M-R pact was signed and poland got cucked, the frogs and anglos realised how much this backfired.
when europe got too small for two superpowers and fearing a soviet sneak attack, it was obvious the soviet union had to be taken out.
when the frogs got roasted and the anglos were cliffhanging they immidietly switched to supporting stalin.
as soon as the war was going in favor of the allies ofcourse it was back to square 1 and you had cold war before the anglos even reached brandenburg.

just throwing it out there, eventho some people will just feel the need to screech

Digits checked, Spain could have done what Italy did and embrace fascism, they could have turned the tide on the war.

Help us refine our meme's user. Our failed godless ideology is losing traction.

Be the quality in the board that you want to see, user.

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Nonsense. Hitler was about the only guy on the German side concerned with strategy. The Generals were still living in the past, wanting to conquer glory cities. Hitler's eyes were on the strategic element from the very beginning, go for their resources. When he fell ill in the late summer of 41, the arrogant officers diverted forces away from his objectives to attempt an impossible attack on Moscow. If Hitler listened to his Generals, Germany wouldn't even have conquered Poland. Bunch of cowardly luddites to be honest. The only thing that saved them was the even worse bafoonery in the enemy camps.

Well have you?

best loli

They were hysterical. France deciding to fight a defense war, when your RIGHT NEXT TO THE FREAKIN' ENEMY. And then the Germans just waltz in like nothing happened.

I liked watching that anime. Although it'd hard to treat that adorable girl with any affection knowing it's a guys soul in there. Kinda ruins it.

It's not cities nor resources you have to worry about. You have to cripple the logistics of the enemy. And Moscow was an important railway hub.

To be fair, they needed an excuse for a believable smart female character.

That's what Stalingrad was. The transport hub for everything traveling on the Volga river (and two other major rivers as well). Without it, the USSR would lose access to 80% of their crude oil, among other things.

I'm a fan of pincer attacks, but I'm not a military strategy expert. Do you know why a frontal attack would have been better?

Nobody "let" Hitler build up Germany. It was solely due to Hitler's will and the will of the people. The Brits and French didn't have any say in this. They were forced to go along with everything that Hitler did and they couldn't do anything.

Fairly certain the user you're responding to is also in favor of a pincer attack.

TBFH Hitler DID meddle in military affairs way too much after Fall of France where his thenrisky decisions of supporting Guderian's experimental strategies proved to be the right ones despite his generals saying otherwise.
This is the main problem with dictators or people in general. Once he did something good he was convinced that he was on pair or even better than his generals. He saw generals as narrow minded military only decision makers. And this tends to result in the man being surrounded with Yes men.

First example which basically cost him the entire war in the East: He detached the 1st Panzer army under Kleist from pursuing disorganized Soviets and subsequently cutting them off/routing BEFORE Stalingrad. Instead he directed them into Caucasus where they got bogged down in the mountains and achieved fuck all for the entire time they were there. The Soviets were instead pursued by infantry and managed to dig down in Stalingrad. Which we all know how transpired. And don't even mention the Italians and Romanians on the left flank.
He did this becouse he wanted to get to the oil fields of Baku fast. So he wanted the economical target instead of the transport hub for the same oil.
The problem was that the Soviets managed to slow the German advance down and regroup at Stalingrad(city) and the Caucasus(hilly terrain and bad for tanks).

Second example would be almost in reverse. He detached Guderian from the army that went to Moscow transport hub for whole European Russia and told him to go to Leningrad, which was almost worthless.
If he went to Moscow he'd get to it before the Russians managed to make all those forts and trenches.

Third example would be his borderline idiotic chivalrous *tips my Stahlkhelm* move of Donquerque. If he had broken the British then, they would be out of the war. But no he was a weaboo for anglos and cared for their precious little Rothschild Empire.

tl;dr Hitler wasn't a perfect man. The fake high after France cost him the war after he overrode the generals way way way too often.
Make no mistake others did many blunders but Hitler didn't have luxury to afford those that he did. Almost the same as the Japanese giga spergout of Yamamoto at Midway.
The difference with the Allies was that they had a lot more manpower, resources and breathing space to do those monumental b

they could have invaded germany again and imposed embargoes on it. Hitler had to negotiate with them to get the sudeten lands and danzig.

knowing germany rised toits power because of its people is one thing, but zealously declaring that they were unstoppable and noone could do anything is another.

the eternal anglo has two main tendencies

having hitler build up germany and then politely pointing him against the communists in the soviet union, who were ofcourse considered a bigger threat than germany (which was defeated once already) in the western world.
the red scare started in the 19th century, not after ww2.

and hitlers staff knew how the anglos planned the war

that was the whole reason behind the molotov ribbentrop pact. taking out the french and anglos before actually turning on the real superpower in europe, the USSR.
or do you beleive the pact was just

People who say this are unironically cuckolds. They're probably the type that hang around with a group of non-white friends and uncomfortably laugh as their black buddy starts saying, fuck whitey.

this.
the same goes for people on here who go for a biased "yes" instead of thinking why "yes" is a good choice.

youd think these would be used as rear troops and auxillary, but the germans saw them as expendable allied cannonfodder.
same with captured french/chezch tanks that horribly fucked up german logistics.

to his defence the germans were in great need for oil, and the fields in romania and africa werent nearly enough, not to mention as you said the hype for blitzkrieg.

the northern seas were the main port for allied shipping. leningrad itself was a major population and industry hub.
still tho, with the army groups center and south using thebulk of german forces the city was beseiged, expecting a quick fall like with kiev and other major cities where the red army retreated in disorder.

amen.

quality post, 9/10
how did you get well read?

Classcucks literally sacrificed their nation and people over losing their status. Rich people were a mistake.

its eternal anglo bias from the conditioning for dying in (((their))) wars in europe.
slavs have their own historic reason for hating germans, as do the french, but anglos are just the insecure bullies on a powertrip because they got (((backing)))

I guess Hitler feared that Russia was preparing to invade Germany, so he preempted Stalin weeks or months in advance (in his mind).
vid related

Instead the jews in the west invaded us with capitalism and completely took over our resources and information-channels, launching a fake cold war vs the East where they controlled both sides and kept white people on their toes while they stole our lands.

Let's face it, nothing was won by losing the war. This is the aftermath and we will correct the mistakes.

a war between two superpowers next to eachother like that was inevitable. ideology had nothing to do with it except for rallying people on both sides.
the soviets were getting ready for that war and the germans wanted to take the shot while they could.

Your memes are garbage shlomo

What I always thought was odd, was that blitzkrieg, war machine warfare general, never uses troops in the same political brinkmanship fashion as, well, politics. Hitler did have to smack Russia. The jews of the USA, England, and Russia were gifting white production to Stalin, who was going to strike. So Hitler struck first, which was so unbelievably correct it becomes without question at any level of analysis… until the post-
Ukraine deep invasion. It was at that point that German supply and comms logistics (and Napoleon logistics) were non-functional, and both armies went off after pet projects, instead of realizing that the unified clear objectives had now become contested and they should return to base (reads: original missions accomplished, now what? go home and sleep, come back when you know what the fuck to do next).

I haven't read any analysis, other than Hitler really wanted capitol blitzkrieg, to suggest why the hell the German forces didn't come back. Nothing in blitzkrieg opposes brinkmanship. It seems that both armies fell into low time preference thinking as they moved into later campaigns.

I could point out the irony in your belieiving yourself to be some sort of historian and military expert like the faggot who clearly blew you the fuck out so badly that he came here to whine and shit up the catalog, but instead I'll just say, WHY DON'T YOU FUCKING ASK THEM? You want US to speak to some loser cuck's mindset on faceberg or whatever shithole you spent your time on? Do you have any idea what's involved with truly answering such a question? How much hacking and monitoring needs to take place? For fucking what? Smarten up and don't post again for two years.

The actual truth, while most here prefer shutting their brain through cheap escapism.

Nigger Stalin was planning to invade very soon, if Hitler had waited it would have been a defensive war.

This is the simplest way of explaining it. Even ((( mainstream ))) historians admit that without USA, Hitler would have won.

We were stuck fighting the Chinese because they got such good weapons from not just the USA but GERMANY. Then again, we should bave invaded China much earlier.

But please, stop the inter-former-axis blame game. It gets no where.

Shut the fuck up, Goon nigger.

O wait, it's a German. Well still, there's plenty of reasons why they're wrong, and mostly because I'm right.

Ayo Japman, how's your country doing?

Bretty good actually. Stock is highest since 1992; almost get rid of pacifist amendment; good relation with USA, India, Dutertia, etc; SK fucks up against Trump; leftists losing influence… Etc. we just have to undo mass 3rd world immigration and that would be about it. Good luck against white genocide lad

There's nothing wrong with aristocrats; there's everything wrong with not replacing them when they get incompetent, and them being too arrogant to give up their positions.

Ideally Aristocrats should give up and handover their positions by "adopting" a competent man of lower class, like what Uësugi Norimasa did to Nagao Kagetora (Uësugi Kenshin); the former was a retard that lost a 80000 to 8000 battle against Houjou, the latter was so good at Warfare that he is remembered as the avatar of Vaiśravana.

Excellent info

Best of luck to you. I hope you folks can rekindle your interest in your Shinto ways.

I'm so jealous. Must be going smoothly I imagine, you're lucky you don't have to deal with jews. They're the exact same people that put us in our current situation today.

they are doing the same thing again in western countries right now with migrants and feminism

archive.org/stream/PoliticalTestamentOfAdolfHitler/PTAH_djvu.txt

essential reading on the subject

heretical.com/miscella/14days.html

Another explanation is that Germans never wanted to. Yes, there was a mess left over from the past 25,000yrs, which had persisted from the last 2000yrs under worsening aggravation. Echos of miscegenation to which the Germans, Poles, and other predecessors/successors of the Danzig State attempted to push back from time to time. But none really wanted to take back the eastern region, only to smash thru, cut down, and retake old/accumulating profits stolen by Asian cannibals.

Again, the objective originally was well understood, intrinsically so by both command and soldier alike: smash up and remove the buildings-of-things threat that was massing to the east. Which was actually obtained leaving July of '42. So, the business of the war machine should have come back, but it didn't.

What?

Another example of this is General Lee with the USA Civil War. Lee and his troops generally, intrinsically, understood the initial business of pressing into the North was to fuck their shit up. Yes, there was some lofty distance of taking Capitol region, but the troops and sub-commanders didn't actually all agree to want to go that far. That is, all mission-general/non-specifics are always viewed as a series-of-stages/objectives to be implemented – to which in these cases the early halves were universally agreed, whereas the later halves were not (or were thought moreso of 'ok, lets do this first and work towards that thing, and when we get closer to that thing over there, we'll revisit the plan again; get closer first = yes, finalize = not so much).

Lee had gone through and obtained the mission general objective by June of 1863. It was around this time that pet projects had already started to be pursued. If instead of pursuing a lack of focus, the war machine general had simply returned to the South, the resulting brinkmanship would have been in the South's favor. (Not that it would have mattered too much in the end).

/polite sage off topic

We have koreans using Jewish tactics, but honestly they are amateur

To redress the later first: (2) That part of the story is always present in all stories. Nothing new. Rather, Franco listening to them is not a testament to their convincing power, but a testament that Franco understood he wasn't much in the first place (Franco could sense that he wasn't enough, that he didn't have enough surplus of might left over to advance any to German, that he was lower engergy and Spain itself was not that useful period). Which leads to redress of (1): Does anyone really think that the left over messes and remnants of the Kazakh kike-over, Whahabist/Isla-mist sandnigging, and general miscegenation was of enough post-clean up phase to stand up again? The State of Iberia general following the post inquizition and purging stage of reformation of 1490 +/- was -recucking-, not uncucking. The Spanish were bought off their cleanup efforts by their own wealth, stolen by the very kikes they sent to the lowlands to go infect somewhere else. Didn't work out so well for them.

As an absurd reduction, it is a bit like wanting Zimbabwe to join any war. Obviously Spain isn't nearly that bad, but it is still Spain, and Spain does still barely have enough transient surplus to deal with it's old African parasite and Asia cannibal issues.

Good fortune to Spain, but face the fact: Spain then is just about what Spain is now: Not exactly that useful.

Yes, the ethernal rice merchant strikes again. Maybe if you did not invade China, and attacked the actual enemies instead? Like the Soviet Union? You rice nigger. Also, did genociding the white Ainu made your dick hard?

Over ten years of /gsg/, military strategy books and hours of WW2 documentaries.

This series is also God tier and I recommend a watch to history buff anons.
It's surprisingly neutral if you ignore some random British remarks about Hitler.
Pure military tactics and a nice explanation of leaders and equipment.

Are you me?

Hindsight is everything, Hitler couldn't predict the future. Looking back, he probably shouldn't have invaded when he did, but I'm sure it was a good idea at the time (the Russians were completely unprepared and folded under Germany for the first few years)

I've been posting this all over lefty/pol and they still have this "Soviet union single-handedly killed the mighty Nazis" delusion even though without British and American support the Nazis would have been marching through Moscow by 1942.

This, the Generals were leftovers from WW1 and still caught in the ideas of Prussian monarchies. They deliberately worked against Hitler every step of the way. He should have replaced them with SS generals.

They even ridicule people like Rommel, and Patton, even though they were both great men their legacy is torn down because they didn't conform to the lefty's agenda.

I always hear the "re-militarisation" argument about they were only successful because all the unemployed were in the army and getting rid of the Jews opened up job opportunities. I know this is false and in no way is a valid way to explain Germany's miracle economy, but do you have solid proof that Germany's economic prosperity was NatSoc policies? I need it for arguing with lefties.

This. Nazi Germany would rule Europe if it weren't for the United State's massive industrial base which is why next time they will be on our side

Those will do you more bad than good. Is this where you have gotten the faulty view of Dunkirk?
Hitler did not let the BEF to escape. He was concerned about the main thrust in France, and Goering had assured him the Luftwaffe would keep them in check. In a few days the army would be back to clean them up. What the Germans had not counted on was the stiff resistance of the RAF and the speedy evacuation. Hitler only bandied around the "I love Britain" part after the fact to save face.

Great post.

pic related might help.
tldr: they kicked out the ((international banking cartel)).

Is there an explanation that doesn't require the existence of an international banking syndicate? I'm arguing with commies on a website where if you mention "Jews" you get axed. I need a more kosher reason.

International finance capitalism.

When you've got the entire British standing army by their throats you don't blame it on the weather.
If they lost them they'd have only untrained conscripts, which wold make them unable to do anything against the Germans for many years since you need a core for your conscript army.
Nigger, Hitler loved and admired the British Empire as they were Germanic in a way. He didn't want Britain lose her colonies so he let them off.
You have to understand that the Fall of France was one of the most surprising historic military victories. Any sensible Power would sue for peace in a blink of the eye. And Brits were historically always pragmatic so he expected them to do so. Only the Rothschild Britain could pull off what they did and lose the Empire to USA and the commies in the process.
Battle for Britain was basically a training exercise for the invasion of Russia.

Unfortunately there were many traitors in the Reich who sabotaged the war effort in many ways.
historynet.com/book-review-hitlers-traitor-martin-bormann-and-the-defeat-of-the-reich-by-louis-kilzer-ww2.htm

Nothing special and small. Britain is and was a naval power. They did fuck all against the Germans for years anyways. British army had no significant impact on the war until D Day, and even then completely dependent on the Americans. Simply put, they were not a priority which is why Hitler focused on finishing France first. This is only considered a blunder in hindsight and because that retreat with the tails between their legs was one of the biggest British "victories" in the war, so they haven't shut up about it since.

Most of us know that nigger. But his use of that as an excuse for "letting the Brits escape" is complete nonsense. It was Rundstedt who shared his concerns with Hitler. Flanks were unprotected, terrain was questionable and the troops needed rest and refitting. Once Goering promised Hitler he could take care of it, the stop order was given. Chivalry for Britain had nothing to do with it.
Hitler's rejection of Ribbentrops offer to suicide Stalin is a better example of his honor getting in the way of pragmatism.

One of my great uncles died in Africa the other in Russia.

The german economy wasn't a miracle and the spending they were doing was unsustainable, though it was never meant to be sustained so that's like arguing that the British economy was unsustainable because they ran a debt making a battlefleet for four years. The reason the economy improved was simply because the Weimar economy had been full of malinvestment to the point that nearly any change would appear a miracle. Kikes had deliberately feed money to the shitty culture of Berlin while roads went unpaved.

Faggots the both of you. The Prussians MADE Germany. Desnazification was never about the natsocs, it was about removing Prussian ideals.

Von Bock warned Hitler repeaditly about taking Moscow and he was the most self professed monarchist in the officers.

The only SS generals worth a damn were Hausser and Sepp

Losing your air force in a training exercise is a bit daft.

Quite astute. Not just Denazification. Not just getting rid of Prussian ideals and traditions. But, ripping the entire soul out of what it means to be Germanic itself. A long, long term plan. If you haven't seen this. Check it out. EDIT: Kept trying to upload a webm. Seems like the servers just can't handle it at the moment. Have an embed.

...

Quite astute. Not just Denazification. Not just getting rid of Prussian ideals and traditions. But, ripping the entire soul out of what it means to be Germanic itself. A long, long term plan. If you haven't seen this. Check it out. EDIT: Kept trying to upload a webm. Seems like the servers just can't handle it at the moment. Have an embed. Also, oops. First post was some German dub. Mods. Clean up my mess.

can you be more clear?

just say that england and france got cold feet when they saw someone got "too big".
throw this
at them.
besides also theres agreat video on banking for them
youtu.be/5hfEBupAeo4

When the war was turning bad, Von Ribbentrop offered to arrange a meeting with Stalin. At that meeting he would gun him down.
Hitler thought it over for a long time, before replying: "No. I don’t like anything like that.
It would be asking for trouble from Providence."

the reason japan was so useless in WW2 is because they were a backward power with 1920s mindset.
they were good at fighting even more backward countries like china and those irrelevant island states, but got bashed when facing actual modern armies.
the main thing keeping them afloat till 45 was a big fleet with good airsupport and entrenched positions on islands.
the chinese only started winning because of the population siding with the communists and the japs being strangled by the allies and soviets

well its very likely that stalin would just be replaced by someone from the inner circle like beria or one of the marshals, and the assasination would be just a horrific boost to soviet morale and fuel for german hate.

Yeah, which is why it isn't true. The air campaign was an attempt to force Britain to peace, making them think Germany was preparing to invade. The peace offer by Hitler was:
When hearing this, Churchill banned all his diplomats from even receiving Germans. If that offer had got out to the British Elite, they'd probably have taken it. This is why Hess made his fateful flight.

You don't replace the authority of Stalin just like that. It would have been a blow similar to losing Hitler for Germany.

definetly. what i had in mind was some "provisional hero to replace the glouriois leader in the time of need" type bullshit, but as soon as the soviets would have breeding space on the front youd have coups springing up.
by that time germany would already be on the losing round

im not ironically trolling, but could you post some sauce?
please

Are you claiming the German air force wasnt crippled by the battle of Britain? Please give your sources

Page 657 in Hitler's War by Irving

No, I'm claiming it was not a training exercise.

This was early 44, so possible it would not have had vital effect. What is interesting is Hitler's reasoning for not doing it. Didn't want to upset the Gods.

well he also refused to use chemical and biological weapones which germany had and could easely cripple the soviets and london with.
the problem wasnt asmuch with honor as with lowering the bar of what means are fair to use in that war.
WW2 was nonetheless alot more civilised than what could have been if everyone went to their limits.

Reminder that the Soviet Army alone mobilized 3 times more men than the Germany Army, and that the British and American armies were of the same size of that of Germany. The French Army was about 80% that of Germany, in 1940.

Not to mention the Equipment production, the Soviets were backed by material supplies from the USA and had literally millions of slaves at their disposal, including at former russian colonies - they conscripted half of all the men in Armenia! Germany's economy was LEVELLED at the end of World War I, after a long blockade, and it had to be rebuilt near from scratch.

They had massive problems with supplying amd equipping their troops, especially when being constantly air-raided and unable to trade overseas, not to mention the fact that, during the Battle of Moscow, the Russian roads turned to mud in the autumn and then they faced -40ºC temperatures in december, which made their vehicles take HOURS to turn, and their machine guns and even rifles unoperational.

What has to be understood is that Operation Barbarossa was inteded as a Blitzkrieg, with the ultimate goal of capturing Moscow - that operation was largely succesful, and destroyed huge amounts of the Soviet Army, but they were bogged down by muddy roads due to melting snow in the autumn, just before their main attack on Moscow - which was slightly delayed and happened in winter, under -40ºC temperatures - this reduced their fighting capabilities, just at a time the Soviets were able to massively reinforce their positions.

Once they were unable to take Moscow, the writing was on the wall - they would have to fight a front-war, in the wideness of Russia, against an Army 3x their size, with endless supplies and slave labor, while also fighting against ALL the rest of the world.

Then, the fragile loyalty of people inside their ranks - like Prussian Military - began to show (and they began defecting to the Rothschilds) - you think it's a coincidence that Finland REFUSED to attack Leningrad, sitting there waiting to see what happened? That the Italian Army was nearly inoperational and failed to mount a single offensive, mostly because of their supplies, due to the fact that their entire high command was compromised by masons - no surprise when their monarchy switched sides at 1943. Romania, Bulgaria, all had their leaderships quickly defect at first chance - even Hungary was only stopped from doing so by the Germans invading their country. The same also happened in Germany (July Plots by Catholic Officers, Rommel being so "praised" by the allies, despite having lost his North African campaign, while noting and explictly stating how corrupted the Italian Army leadership was, and so on…), but they were more efficient in dealing with traitors.

You have to remember (((their))) main tactic, employed since before Napoleon, was to use their agents to sabotaged their enemies supplies and structures. This showed in Stalingrad - it was no coincidence there was massive supplies problems just there, that the General in command allowed their armies to be trapped and then willingly defected to the Soviets, advocating for them later on.

They followed Hitler, when it was tenable that he could provide a final victory - when the fall of the current order was very tangible. When, after the Battle of Moscow, already in 1941, it became untangible - they quickly reverted their loyalty to (((them))) and worked to undermine the Reich. This is why Goebbels gives speeches about "Total War" in 1943 - because the Reich would fight uncompromissing to the very end - which they did.

You can argue that - "but they would surrender to the Americans, so it was less bad" - but it's not true - not only because the Americans and Western Allies actually killed millions of German Prisoners of War (they just didn't have the use for slave labores in Siberia - because they were capitalists - so it's less evident), but also because hastening the collapse of the Western Front (which traitors like Rommel did sucessfuly, offering token resistance in Normandy and allowing the Americans to reach as far as Berlin before the Soviets, but their (((high command))) ordered them to back down, to cozy up to the Soviets) would mean any resistance to the Soviets in the East would be IMPOSSIBLE, allowing them to freely destroy unnoposed. Also, it was cowardly and dishonorable…

And in the end, even if they did take over in the East, the US would have develloped the Nuclear Bomb anyway, and dropped it in BERLIN

The European British Army alone was of similar size to the German, if you count the colonies, especially Indian Conscripts, it was BIGGER than the entire military of Germany. Britain was a very militarized nation, and yes, on land too, especialy after World War I

Hitler already did NOT surround himself with Prussian nobility, he enlisted their support because he wanted to enlist all groups in Germany, regardless of social class and region, to the reich, and because, especially as a condecorated veteran, he valued them for their military capabilites and general militarism, which he wanted to implement in the Reich

Indeed. Barbarossa was planned with the objective of destroying the Soviet armies on the border only, then the regime would start to disintegrate they believed/hoped. Moscow was not a target for Hitler though, that came later when the Generals overrode him on his sickbed. Hitler wanted to push on hard to the Caucasus. Goring in Nuremberg called it Hitler's plan of genius and believed the war would have been won if it had been followed.

In the end Hitler said every military defeat by Germany had been due to treason. The Battle of the Bulge was the only major battle the Germans fought without the enemy knowing all their positions. To fight a war like that and almost win, blind and exposed, shows the military genius of Hitler. He made mistakes, but who doesn't.

Hitler didn't mind Prussians, not at all. His issue was with the nobility, who also dominated the military. Soldiers like Skorzeny, one of the baddest in the entire war, were as sons to him. These fellas would graduate military school by a fencing match. Opponents stood at a distance where there sword could reach their face. They were not allowed to move anything but their arm and as much as flinching when hit was considered dishonor. When you see a German soldier with a big ass scar on their face, it's because of that.

Which ones?

I think you may have responded to the wrong post.

not needed for anyone who isnt a newfag.
weve all sat trough dozens of WW2 and war strategy threads here, presuming there arent newfags lurking.

moscow was a seond stage objective.
the primary objective was encircling and destroying soviet army groups and capturing strategic areas like mountain ranges, rivers and big cities with an exception of heavely fortified moscow.

the supply problem was a result of the german advance halting. the entire operation was planned to be executed in two swift phases in no more than a year, with supplies from fuel to gear parts and manpower being speculated in there.
instead they got pyrrhic victory; winning most battles but getting too drawn out at the end to finish it.

you really like to speculate in hindsight.

topkek
Germany's "suicide" tactic was what brought Communism into europe by allying with Communism to invade the frontguardian of europe for "muh territory".
Thanks Germany for giving us a world free of communism just like Poland did in 1920… Oh wait.

You don't understand politics at all if you think that they could have done this.

Without Germany, Stalin would've reached the Atlantic Ocean faster than you could scream kurwa.

Yet we stopped him, and when he offered to invade you mutually instead of Britain, we declined. As if, the German delusion lives on.

Yeah, sure you would have beaten them. How long did it take Poland to fall in WW2 again?

It was Italy's fault, or specifically Mussolini's fault

what the germans achieved WAS incredible, that doesn't mean they made no mistakes.

they could. under the pretext of germany not sticking to the versilles treaty on war reparations and rearmament.
france occupied western towns in germany and held them until they were handed over to hitler under the policy of loosing the leash on germany so that they could face the soviets.

both the french and british had multiple divisions on the Maginot line ready to invade germany.
Poland was ofcourse thrown under the bus so that the anglos could have hitler suicide himslef along with stalin, but when sudenly the two made a pact the anglos needed to act and poland suddenly became a "great ally" and gave them an excuse to declare war.

...

mamma mia

Truly, the most powerful military in the world.

I thought it was generally accepted that the Japs shouldn't have attacked Pearl Harbor and should have focused on tag teaming the commies with the axis forces from the west.
I am quite ignorant on this topic though. It never made any sense to me why the Nips did what they did and I'd actually appreciate any knowledgeable anons to spread some light on this topic.

From what I understand, America was selling them oil, but stopped because the Japanese wouldn't stop removing chink. Japan will grind to a halt if it doesn't get that oil, and despite constantly pressing for peace, they eventually run out of time and have to either the European territories in Asia or pull out of China. The attack on Pearl Harbor was a gambit to keep America out of the war by knocking out our navy. Unfortunately for them, America wanted into the war, and was waiting for Japan to attack them, so that we could declare war on them and their ally, Germany.

The US entered the war December 7, 1941
VE Day was May 8, 1945.
About 3.5 of the 12.5 years.
Didn’t even need an atomic bomb.
Without nukes the Japs never would have surrendered.

The battles between the Japanese and Soviet Armies in the 1930s showed that an invasion of the Russian Far East was basically impossible. The Japanese army was outnumbered and too primitive.

If the Japanese had attacked the Soviets in 1941 it would have helped the Germans immensely because the Soviets wouldn't be able to reinforce themselves with Far Eastern troops, but the Japanese themselves would have been stomped on.

they stopped because the japs were getting too close to anglo commonwealth

what they lack in military power they have in diplomacy.
somehow they always end up sucking dick to get on the winning side and get some nice "spoils of war".

tbh it feels good to see them getting fucked by those commies from the east after ww2 and losing a big batch of land in the northeast.

Don't underestimate them. Stalin had already drawn a lot of his troops from the Far East back to Moscow so it was already far weaker. And the Japanese Army, while not Europe-tier, was certainly not something to laugh at. Even if they didn't actually advance, it would certainly draw a lot of resources from the Eastern front.

how about you look at it from their perspective

A lot of people are only aware of the pop meme version of history and have no idea why Germany did anything they did. Someone should make a tl;dr infograph with all the shit that gets glossed over that leads to these dipshit views of history.

...

The only reason Russia held on was because of foreign aid and arms.

You should spend more time despising the real culprits, Jewish British elite and other assorted Jews.

Prussia will be restored.

I don't see why it should be restored. We are trying to avoid more brother wars, are we not? Why take from the Poles when we can take from the Africans or Arabs?

Unless your taking about that Russian part

Is this a joke or are you really this retarded? Do you know the scale of the red army that was stationed at the border right before Barbarossa hit?

Italien's at least helped. The Spaniards should have given Hitler control of Gibraltar.

Didn't they all experience an economic recession? It would've been hard to motivate the population for a new war. I mean Germany's military was still in existance, Prussian ideals existed also. Then there were also allies like Italy and so on. I don't really think that it would've as easy as you think, this scenario is not in a vacuum, there are all sorts of moving parts.

Who cares? Stalin would probably invade them anyways with millions of his paratroopers.

[citation needed]

Me think both the germans, americans and russians oughta to step down a notch.

The germs were great at tactics but their strategy is actually full of holes.

Same for americans and soviet, but they get more resources so they win.

Mass deployment of paratroopers is suicide, and the Soviet lacks an air force to completely dominate Britain.

But the Third Reich did make military blunders? What, do you think that they were somehow impervious to human error? Everyone assumes their primary blunder was invading the Soviet Union. No, their real error was not coordinating with the Japanese and conducting that invasion from both directions prior to the U.S. coming into the war. Additionally they made little if any preparations to convert Soviet infrastructure and rail lines, meaning resupply had to be done mostly by truck which was a massive drain on fuel and spare parts. Later in the war Hitler did exactly what Stalin did in 1940 and prohibited strategic retreats for a time, leading to numerous highly trained and well equipped units being encircled and destroyed.

Hitler had been a corporal during the first World War. He should NEVER have taken personal command of the German military. His strengths were as an orator and a propagandist, he was no military genius and not a particularly good diplomat either.

You can believe in a cause without feeling compelled to defend its mistakes guys. I wish the Crusades had succeeded but I'm not going to pretend like there was much success to be had following the First Crusade. Nor am I going to tell myself it's purely because of external forces and not because the knights of Europe and their armies made some serious strategic blunders.

It was inevitable. However, as I mentioned in the above post lack of foresight and proper coordination between the Axis powers was the real killer. That being said, Wehraboos don't like to admit that yes, the Germans did in fact make mistakes, some very serious ones in fact which ultimately led to defeat. The Axis weren't defeated purely by industrial output and population disparity.

Pick one, there was quite a democratic aspect in National socialism, such as on larger issues the people would vote on issues, but the government took care of smaller issues. It's more of an aristocratic government, since as we can see today what happens when the Jews break down our systems of governance and make a mockery out of them. This is the only way to ensure stability is long rule of great men, and this will be especially apparent when life extension is pursued and also space exploration, which relies on life extension.

Japan had no choice. US planned to provoke attack from Japan even before Pearl Harbor was a thing just to make an excuse for declaration of the war, except they they wanted to do it later, not before they could prepare enough bombers to transfer them to Philippines so they could burn all the country immediately after successful provocation, to make sure that US would lose absolutely nothing.
I thought people on this board of all places learned something from 9/11? This tactic is nothing new and US used it successfully many times to portray itself as a 'victim'.

Even regarding of Khalkhin-Gol English kikepedia page shows how 'primitive' Japanese army was. Just look at casualties there and the size of both armies or supplies. Or do you perhaps believe Soviet's propaganda about how small sized their army was against hugely sized Japanese army consisted from over 75000 troops and how easily they won that battle against them?

For fuck's sake, you could even use some logic if you're not familiar with Sino-Japanese War, Pacific War topics or with Soviet-Japanese conflicts. I.e. why else do you think Stalin decided to keep a lot of his troops on Far East border and for too long, despite when Hitler begun his attack on Stalin.

And the problem why Japan didn't want to be involved aside from China or Allied Asian colonies and upcoming war with US was the fact that Japan was also pissed and lost trust in Germany as an Ally when Hitler 'sided' with Soviets by signing Molotov-Ribbentrop pact and refused to help during Nomonhan Incident. Japan did the same exactly thing when Hitler decided to get into the war with Soviets: both signed Non-Aggression pact, almost right after Operation Barbarossa begun, just like Molotov-Ribbentrop pact happened after Japan started its attack on USSR. Japan simply couldn't pull off that attack alone due to China where majority of the army was, just like Hitler couldn't afford war with USSR when on the other side he had frogs with Brits and it was very critical for Japan to keep majority of its army in China for obvious reasons. The relationship with Germany became much colder after Molotov-Ribbentrop pact.

It's true that Japanese army didn't have much of advanced equipment (barely anything changed from 30's) and wasn't as good overall compared to German army, not Soviets or Allied Army at that time. Mainly this is very true for tanks which weren't really needed to win the war in China and were quite useless in the end, but you clearly exaggerate and possibly don't understand the reasons either. Japan couldn't afford too much resources to begin with so majority of it was put into navy instead of army because chinks could be beaten with what the army had at that moment, same goes for Allied colonies and their troops there. Chinese barely had any tanks hence it was decided to use light tanks during this war at first. However, it was much easier to rely on infantry instead of tanks, mainly because roads were shitty in China and caused some nuisance. Cavalry, on the other hand been able to move much faster in Asian environment and thus it was much more effective.

US with Brits navy, on the other hand, were much more serious threat and that's how Japan planned to get them out, with a powerful and more advanced navy instead of army because it was pointless to go outside of Asia, the goal of Japanese Empire was to get rid of Allies from the entire Asia and deal with chinks, not to conquer the entire US or UK. The same lack of resources was the biggest reason why Pearl Harbor was planned the way it was: it was necessary to weaken US as much as possible to get them out of the game without opening another front because the army was already too busy due to infinite quantity of chins, all that with the first try only because there would be no other better chance due to lack of resources (if we exclude Operation MI which was too risky and cost almost everything). Had Hawaii Operation succeeded as planned, it would greatly cripple the US navy. But of course US knew everything they needed just like they knew about Midway, so it was all pointless.

Anyway, with its army Japan could definitely take on Soviets with a help of Germany, just like Germany could make better progress had Japan helped it in the war, even if Japan had to keep fighting in China too at the same time. The army wasn't total shit you're trying to make it be, quite on the contrary. Imperial Japanese army might be stomped by Germans but not by Soviets unless they used their zergrush tactics or competent general whom Soviet army lacked since Stalin stabbed majority of them back in 30's. Moreover, the army actually did quite well against Allied troops too before Operation MI happened and US finally had the data about our plans and necessary intel from that point on, what of course I blame on the command. But it wasn't surprising, Operation MI failure made huge negative impact on Imperial Japan.

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caused by the people running the show yes.
they could just lend enough to beat germany up again.

it wasnt hard right after 1939. besides, hitler was still "useful" to them before the R-M pact.

1) the USSR developed its airdrop strategies after WW2.
2) thats exactly the reason they needed hitler.

Defensive wars are much easier to win, though.

well no, not on that scale.
and certainly not on the norz european plain.
most succesful guerrila wars were fought in areas not favorable to massive armies.

Checked never forget dubs

Wow, this is fascinating. I always wondered why Germany and Japan, despite being "allies", never did anything together in WWII. Perhaps this is a newfag question to ask, but in all my lurking I have yet to see an answer to it: why was Japan attacking China in the first place?

The Russian far east is actually quite temperate. You are thinking of inland Siberia. If you look at the latitude of the Far East you can see that it shares the climate of North Japan. Certainly better than a few scattered islands in the middle of nowhere.

They are easier to win after the first year. The attack has a huge advantage for the first year or so but looses it once the war drags on. Unfortunately for Hitler, if Stalin attacked first he could have overrun Poland and be at Berlin before their advantage runs out. The Soviets didn't have the disadvantage of weather and poor infrastructure.

German war tactics and machinery were also geared for offence. The Blitzkrieg tactics were completely focused on breaking infantry lines in rapid pace. It doesn't work for long, static defensive front.

When Prussia is restored, retribution will be long and drawn out, you fucking subhuman.

It's not really that simple and to understand why, you'd have to go through the history of East Asia and the ancient relations between Korea, China and Japan. Throughout their history they've shared in war (for expansion), philosophy, trade and general cultural exchange. Even before the major use of gunpowder, (i.e. 400 AD during the Kofun period) they would lead fleets to each others respective countries.

Alright, so historical enemies I guess. That still doesn't tell me if there was an explicit reason for that particular war. Can you enlighten me, or point me to a non-kiked source where I can read about it?

Incorrect. Japan wanted to surrender in January of 1945 but Roosevelt refused the offer.

The atom bombs were what got Truman his 33rd degree.

What? Unless you count the Mongolian invasion, Japan and China warred only twice: in the 7th century and 16th century over Korea.

They wanted to become a world power. They saw China as their equivalent to British India.

Adding to that, not only do soviet documents revealed in 1991 say that the Japanese Army offered decent resistance and that the numbers for Japanese and Soviet casualties thitherto were fake, it doesn't make any sense for the Soviets to not take Manchuria then and there if the Japanese (specifically the Kwungtung army) were weak.

We already beat them, and we weren't alone you autist, we fought for the Baltic, Belarus, Ukraine, Georgia, our goal was to have Russia split into hundreds of little independent republics, and it worked for the most part. Did Germany's plan work?

Pls.

The greatest military tragedy for the Germans has always been logistics. If they had adopted the intermediate cartridge earlier they would have had an enormous advantage in firepower over the everyone else.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/StG_44#Earlier_development

The Wehrmacht simply wasn't outfitted for winter warfare. They would have been much better off outmaneuvering the soviets on the plains. If Rommel had been used to tie up the soviets in the ukraine while fighting a delaying action, then more manpower could have been diverted to the other fronts.

He's not, now you're realizing why the Nazis were so retarded, its all a Jewrman ploy for Greater Germany.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lend-Lease
Wrong. The U.S. supplied ressources including military equipment to all the Axis opposition even before the U.S. participated in the war itself. The Soviets only won because of this. And the Germans declared war on Soviets because they knew that would happen and hoped to defeat them preemptively before the U.S. gave them enough shit to attack Germany, just like the U.S. helped China even though they were supposed to be neutral. Soviets were eager to conquer Europe since forever, and both the U.S. and Germany knew that. In retrospect, starting the War itself was the biggest mistake. Poland never was a danger, Germans should have tolerated the autistic fit and political agressions from weak Poland and kept them as a shield against Russia while strengthening themselves and allying with other European nations.

(checked)
Agree completely. Too many ignorant faggots around here lately.

If you get Sakhalin back any chance we can borrow it as a jumping-off point for a few decades?
Look at where it is, too. Absolutely nigger proof.

they were allies just because germany saw that they were an empire and werent under (((their))) control.
germany did support china, but they were even more useless as an ally, so they went with japan.

and the source of your geopolitical analasys couchgeneral?

the USSR was a second version of the russian empire.
empires usually have a bunch of other countries under their rule.
you didnt shatter russia.
you didnt do anything.
the only thing that happened was that the burgers eventually forced the USSR to do a paradigm shift and dissolve.

the USSR was a second version of the russian empire.
empires usually have a bunch of other countries under their rule.
you didnt shatter russia.
you didnt do anything.
the only thing that happened was that the burgers eventually forced the USSR to do a paradigm shift and dissolve.

Your nose is showing.

thank you captain hindsight

they werent nazis because they wanted greater germany, they wanted greater germany because they were nazis you dumbass.

It's not wise to just assume he did everything perfectly.
For starters his biggest mistake was the unfinished job of the jews.

They had a significant issue with black-pill propaganda.
And a lack of mental toughness.

That is why I say it wasn't the best job Germany could have done.
They could have also played it more smoothly and diplomatic early on.
And then say provocative things that put the enemy into a frenzy without being able to attack you.

Who does that nowadays btw?

Problem is Germany was not defensible. You had France to the West with a huge, top army. Poland and Czechoslovakia to the East, both with million strong armies and much state of the art equipment. All of them hostile. Then you have the Soviet farther East. The country that were on a peace time war footing, planning to conquer the world.

The time was certainly ripe to ACT. Germany did, the allies didn't. And now we are all hostages to Jewry.

Problem was it was, but because of circumstances they could secure resources to protect it.
That oil issue completely stalled the push east. They nearly had Moscow.
Had that happen, they would have had the world.

theres adark joke i remember on this:

Oil was not a problem short term. Getting that oil to the front however. Part of the reason for not reaching Moscow was the logistics not keeping up. And that was a problem not easily solved with the vast spaces involved and partisan activity to the rear.

tl;dr version of WW2 can be summed up as one small country rebelling against the World. A defeat shouldn't come as a surprise really.

Nah, the Soviets had already moved so much shit to the East they would have survived as a rump state. Japan would likely have still be crushed no matter what as Germany was simply in no place to support them. Britian would have perhaps continued a much weaker Empire. New France would be the ally of Germany and thereby provide defacto control of Europe.

America would likely have done just about the same thing with Japan. Germany would be considered an enemy but the relationship would be the reverse of the USSR. The government during WW2 pushed hard that the USSR was friendly and would reform but the people hated communism and had for some time. A post-war Germany would be tolerated by the masses at best and constantly slandered by the Government if only because they would actually be competition in a way the USSR never could manage.

Back then most of the world outside of Europe weren't that significant.

Hell, Japan was one of the few non European countries (if any other at all) to actually have an empire at the time.
And they did get a significant portion of Europe on their side too, at a time when the proportion of the European population in the world was far bigger than what it was now.

Oh and this is ignoring white countries outside of Europe.

So? Europe was still home to 2 world empires and an emerging juggernaught in Russia. Then of course you had America. That's every power wort a damn lining up to fight a Germany that was dead broke half a decade earlier.

Because the European population + the Japanese population at the time was a significant amount. Enough that it nearly won the war.

Mainland European*

I need a siesta.

A map. The Japanese were planning on conquering the Philippines and parts of Indonesia. Everywhere else was going to be non-Japanese governed.

What's your logic, brainlet? The USSR directly opposed the Russian empire and slaughtered it's nobility in order to usurp rule in the first place.
OK…and? We were directly responsible for the western Ukrainian republic while the Polish-Soviet war was known as the Polish war for Ukrainian independence, but that effort failed when the Ukrainians sided with the USSR. Both Jozef Haller and Jozef Pilsudski led troops during the Estonian war of independence. We housed the Georgian government in exile and coordinated effort to stop Boshlevism in the Caucasus. We did way more than Germany, who's actions meant the Boshleviks too more land, and even Germany at the end of the war, how amazing.

The Iranians and Siamese had their own country; that's about it as far as I know.

Invading Poland allowed for the borders of German control to be much further to the east.

Waiting out to ally with European powers would have given the allies and comintern too much time.

Liberia, Ethiopia, Saudi Arabia, Turkey, Oman, Iraq, Yemen, Afghanistan, Nepal, Bhutan, the various Chinese warlords, Tibet, Mongolia, Tannu Tuva and most of South America also had their own country.

It's really simple. Japan needed resources. The annexation of Korea was only the first step.

The national socialists did make some mistakes during their campaign, most of which could be contributed to Hitler's lack of trust for his generals.

The first biggest blunder was crushing the revolution in Greece instead of going ahead with barbosa straight away. If Barbosa had started earlier the invasion would not have stalled at Stalingrad and the Soviets wouldve been crushed.

The second blunder that Hitler made was ordering general Erwin Rommel to kill himself. Love him or hate him Rommel was one of the most intelligent generals in the history of warfare, and his intelligence could have been greatly used in the eastern front, if Hitler had not had Rommel directing the Afrikakorp sideshow then the U.S.S.R wouldve begged for mercy.

The third blunder was declaring war on the Americans after the Japanese bombed pearl harbor. The japs were probably hitlers strongest military ally unlike the Italians, but by the time pearl harbor occurred it should have been clear to Hitler that they were too loose cannon to act in concert with the Germans. If the Japanese had worked in concert with the Germans and attacked the U.S.S.R from the east the Soviets would have been destroyed.

Overall Hitler's generals were brilliant men who knew much more about war strategy then the füher. If he wouldve placed more faith in them then the good guys would've won WWII.

gtfo.
try harder.

some idelaistic dumbfuck you are.
russia just changed flags and the people who lead it, it was still russia.
just as france was still france after they cut the kings head off.

oh i tought you were talking about modern times.
yeah we wuz kangs n shieet too.
get up to date with this thread.

Under Bolshevik rule Russia tried it's hardest to not be Russia anymore, eastern orthodoxy was banned, the only bbbn people who were allowed to be celebrated were Lenin, Stalin and maybe Marx, your ancestors were all just future graves to the Soviets.

The U.S.S.R was not still Russia, it was Russia's corpse being used to slaughter Europeans.

The Blue Division (Spanish: División Azul, German: Blaue Division), officially designated as División Española de Voluntarios by the Spanish Army and 250. Infanterie-Division in the German Army was a unit of Spanish volunteers and conscripts that served in the German Army on the Eastern Front of the Second World War.[1] It also included 1,000 men of the Portuguese Legion sent by the Portuguese Estado Novo under the Spanish Flag, many of whom had already fought in the Viriatos during the Spanish Civil War.
The Blue Division was the only component of the German Army to be awarded a medal of their own, commissioned by Hitler after the effectiveness it had impeding the advance of the Red Army.

Although Spanish dictator Francisco Franco did not officially bring Spain into World War II on the side of Nazi Germany, he permitted volunteers to join the German Army (Wehrmacht) on the condition they would only fight against the Soviet Union on the Eastern Front, and not against the Western Allies or any Western European occupied populations. In this manner, he could keep Spain at peace with the Western Allies, while repaying German support during the Spanish Civil War and providing an outlet for the strong anti-Communist sentiments of many Spanish nationalists. Spanish foreign minister Ramón Serrano Súñer suggested raising a volunteer corps, and at the commencement of Operation Barbarossa, Franco sent an official offer of help to Berlin.

Hitler approved the use of Spanish volunteers on June 24, 1941. Volunteers flocked to recruiting offices in all the metropolitan areas of Spain. Cadets from the officer training school in Zaragoza volunteered in particularly large numbers and were given leave by the Spanish army. Initially, the Spanish government was prepared to send about 4,000 men, but soon realized that there were more than enough volunteers to fill an entire division: 18,104 men in all, with 2,612 officers and 15,492 soldiers.

Keep in mind Spain had been rekk'd by civil war just a few years prior.

The reason the Germans lost the war is because their allies SUCKED. Look at every defeat, it was because their shitty allies couldn't fight on their own or hold the line and it always ended up with the Germans having to divert troops away or getting outflanked. Complete shit show.

The Italians kept going off half cocked and fucked up every time.

The Finns wouldn't assist beyond their reconquered borders.

The Japs decided to go fuck with the USA and left the USSR alone. And even after being sneaky fucks, they still ended up getting smacked around in some of the most lopsided battles ever. (They don't call it the Great Marianas Turkey Shoot for nothing.)

The Spaniards refused to help, even after all Hitler did for Franco. What a faggot. If the Germans could've invaded Gibraltar things would've turned out differently.

And the rest are a bunch of low tier niggers and no one can even remember what they did or didn't do. I mean really, what did Romania do? (I mean, besides completely fucking up and letting their German buddies get surrounded at Stalingrad.)

The history of the world would've been so much better if the Germans could've had at least one decent ally. Just ONE!

Their allies sucked because they were infiltrated to the core - their high command filled with freemasons and other agents of the Rothschilds, who sabotaged their supplies and organizations. The Third Reich was a lot more effective on dealing with these than their allies were.

Guess what - there is a reason why the Italian army was inoperational during the war (as note by, among others, Rommel, who would later commit treason) and it's monarchy switched sides as early as 1943. There is a reason why Finland sat idle and did not attack Leningrad, switching sides later on, as did Romania and Bulgaria (and Hungary too later, but it was swiftly invaded). Some were not entirely loyal to (((them))) and were playing kingmaker - they followed Hitler when he offered a prospect of an endsieg, destroying the Soviet Union and taking control of the entire continent, but when they were not able to blitzkrieg Moscow, and were facing the prospect of a large field war against an army thrice their size and with limitless resources and slave labour, backed by the near the entirety of other countries, their allies loyalty quick went away.

Hitler was almost literally one man against the whole word. Even against his own allies and his own people.

Thinking about it like that and it's quite funny how people try to denigrate his qualities. 'If he had moved that Panzer group another place!'. Making an uneven situation that uneven tells you all you have to know about the genius of Hitler, and the power of the will.

the war was lost as soon as Germany lost North Africa.
Then the allies could set up airbases in the region and fly bombers into Europe. That's what fucked everything.

The plan was to hold NA until 43, and that Rommel did. By then the war against the USSR should be over.

They just didn't count on Stalin having an endless supply of divisions to throw at them. The Germans estimated around 200 divisions in 1941. The real number was 350. In 1942 the Soviets had managed to get even stronger, while the Germans could muster a mere 5 infantry divisions for replenishment.

Losing a war facing overwhelming odds can hardly be called a mistake.

certainly overwhelming odds. For that reason the whole war strategy of Hitler and the Nazi party was foolish. There must have been a better way. Look at us now. Because of their excesses, we have lost freedom of speech, of assembly, and will lose many more before this is over.

And in the case of Spain and Portugal, they were very sympathetic to Hitler - but knew they could be of little help, so they didn't even commit to join the war and face naval attacks from the allies, creating an unnecessary front…

Rommel was implicated on an attempt to assassinate Hitler along with cucky catholic generals. He deserved to die, the Third Reich knew how to handle traitors, and the implications of not doing it well enough, would have been terrible - as happened in Italy, for instance. He may have even been giving token resistance to the allies later on hoping the US would take most of Germany (which happened, no less due to the traitors part, but proved to be a mistake, as the Allied command ordered their armies to back down and let the Soviets take Berlin). Not that he could do much about it, since the allies knew almost all the german positions due to traitors…

Getting supplies to the frontline was a main problem - the years of the war had some of the coldest winters recorded - the temperatures in the battle of Moscow reached -40ºC, causing a lot of trouble, not just to soldiers who had to keep warm and be delivered winter clothings and fire supplies, but also to equipments - vehicles took hours to get started or wouldn't start at all, the weapons, especially machine guns, were impaired by it, as were aircraft. And the advance to Moscow was delayed, because it snowed in October, which quickly melted, turning roads into shit.

This is correct, it's also hard to imagine what would have happened if the US develloped nuclear bombs while still at war with a dominant Germany…

Lol what? It's Germany's fault there is a Jewish cabal working against whites?

thats why they tried to expand

what?

just like al-nusra was not still alqaeda

last i checked they wanted to conquer europe, not kill everyone in it.

I'd expect more from this. Irving debunked this based on interviews with the Generals the Jews didn't kill. The idea was that if AH didn't do his sideshow in Greece, he'd have gotten into Russia earlier. False. All the waterways were way too flooded. If he had waited? The Jews under Stalin were planning a preemptive attack.

most of that went to the UK and was pretty small.

that was around 1.6 billion, 4% of lend lease.

because of food and other good supplies yes probably. but not because of "muh tanks" that the US gave a few thousand of shitty pieces of.

actaully the anglos and french knew that.
the americans didnt really give a shit and were happy to see a war where they could loan and sell to all sides, and the germans were too beat down to do anything oustide their borders.
so the frogs and anglos let germany build up again so they could have them and the soviets destroy eachother without the anglos doing much else than suckerpunching both in the end and remaining the sole european power.

poland would be thrown under the bus in any scenario.
the anglos sold out them, the checzs and a whole bunch of other nations so they could bring germany up against the soviets.
when the molotov-ribbentrop pact got signed which allowed hitler and stalin to build up and focus on other things the anglos and frogs autistically screeched as their plan backfired and suddenly stepped in to "help their ally" poland, while in reality they just wanted to put down the dog that turned on the wrong folks.
but their force amassed in france wasnt a match for germanys that was now almost entirely on the western front and they got steamrolled.

after that when there were only 2 great powers left in continental europe the eastern front was inevitable.

the anglos would never waste their own men for a war they dont have to fight. as soon as germany would beat the USSR and be exhausted enough they would take them out. the whole point of a new great war in europe was to take out any countries left not under rothschild control. which meant completely destroying the german people once and for all in this last war and removing the communist empire that stalin wanted to run himslef and take over europe.

The goals were clear, to end threat from Soviet territory and possibly take over and destroy the communist threat.

The problem wasn't just that SU was supplied by the USA, it was that Soviet Union revolutionized their weaponry at a much earlier stage than Germany did, the production of weaponry in soviet union was far greater than that of Germany.

To be fair the Germans had two options. The first was waiting out until the Soviet Union would inevitably attack. Likely this would be coordinated at a time the British would also be conducting major attacks (US wasn't formally in the war yet). To win in this way it's essential that Germany would industrialize captured regions and take advantage of their increased weaponry production to counter the Soviets eventually. At that time it was much easier to defend territory and cities. If no planes or artillery were used the invader had to outnumber hard to have a chance to break through.

The later, which is what the Germans did, is striking before the Soviet Union would attack. The positions of Soviet troops and bases were poor for defensive options which allowed Germany to get to Moscow and St Petersburg fast. When they arrived there they encountered major difficulty in the fact that these two cities were loaded with anti air weaponry and German blitzkrieg tactics wouldn't work since air raids were nigh impossible to conduct. So the Germans decided to surround these two cities and force a capitulation. This strategy is very rational, it would take some kind of clairvoyant to tell the Germans to not do this but instead hold territory in Ukraine and force a peace / surrender from SU.

First: it was way more than a few thousand tanks. FDR gave all the materials the USSR needed to ascend to the modern age. They had the manpower. Boom, commies got enough to keep their awful economical system for more 40 years.

Second. A few thousand tanks when you had none makes the world of a difference.

Third. FDR didnt only gave resources to the USSR. ALL Allied powers were benefitted somehow with guns, supplies and logistical parts for fighting the Axis.

Post-FDR gibs, you mean. Yes, they became ahead with USA's money, and when Germany was starting to lose ground after that.

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This.

the russian lands got industrialised in the 20s.

the red army had almost 120 thousand armored fighting vehicles plus the 12 thousand given by the US, 1400 of which were M3 Lee models and 4000 older sherman models.

i know. over half of lend lease went to britain.

if the revolution went on the allies could have established a corridor.
the germans organised an entire offensive against yugoslav partisans some time later for this exact fear.

tbh Italy's problem was in their logistics and their officer corps, both of which were full of reactionary elitists butthurt over the fascists, who deliberately did everything they could to lose the war thinking the allies would give them back their power afterwards. That's why Italy lost against Greeks, the Italian officers didn't want to win. It wasn't anything the Italian soldiers did wrong.

Italian troops themselves did fine under German leadership which was determined to win, poorly under Italian leadership which was determined to lose.

The only mistake Fascist Italy made was not killing every single reactionary as soon as they took over and having Germany train new officers. Reactionaries hate fascism, they are not our friends, they are not even allies.

Yeah, they also hadn't got their industry up to spec before the war started. Germany already had a large amount of industry before the war, while Italy was still developing. Not that I am saying the war should have been delayed, if Hitler waited the Soviets and French would have developed a better army which would counteract Italy being a more competent power.

I remember being taught in college though I don't have any source at hand something like Italy's internal development assessment said they would be ready for the war in 1943 or so, I think for the Germans it was '41, though people back then thought that the French would be able to stop the Germans. They had more tanks, better ones, and the pansy Maginot Line.

OT more likely to happen Turner Diaries or Civil War 2?

Why not let them attack?

Mobilization. If the enemy has 10 times your number, your only real chance is knocking them out before they have all men on deck and factories at full production. Going back to WW1 countries took weeks and months to fully mobilize their armies, so you could kind of have a big surprise attack edge.

Weren't they developing some secret weapons?

All countries tried to (what are nukes and jets), though I'm not the man to ask for specifics.

That's fucking stupid. Hell, the US wasn't even a part of WWII until 3 years after it started. The least these low energy faggots can do is fact check their own false arguments so any normalfag can't immediately debunk them with a 3 second (((Google))) search.

This is probably true, but even though neither nation's industry was at optimum if they delayed the war the Soviets might have recovered from the purge or the French might have revised their poor military doctrine. The US would be able to get out of the depression which would decrease their isolationist attitude.

no, youre thinking of C&C red alert.
the only thing everyone worried about were new tactics of warfare and the scale of armies.

Read or listen "The Epic Story of the Waffen SS". The SS didn't have the right equipment for such a harsh winter but still managed to deal a lot of damage.

Also keep in mind that the USA was giving the Ruskies weapons, ammo and equipment like it was water, because communism.

Hitler's greatest mistake was not invading the Soviet Union. They were already planning a preemptive strike, as others have already pointed out.
His mistake was also not invading too early or too late. As others have pointed out, a May invasion would have been delayed by the spring mud and thus the fantastic encirclements that happened early on would have not happened.
His greatest mistake is the exact same fucking mistake that many on Holla Forums are making right now. Slav hate.
Hitler had a gift. A fucking gift from the White Gods. That gift was the horrible oppression the people of the USSR had suffered under the (((Soviets))). If Hitler and his generals could have just gotten over their stupid "shit on all Slavs" mentality and promised liberty to all the Slavic Peoples that revolted, the USSR would have disintegrated. Stalin was exceptionally paranoid with good fucking reason and if he even suspected that the Ukrainians & other oppressed peoples of the Soviet Union would have revolted, his only option would be to start killing them. Which would have triggered more revolts and the collapse of the state.
And before you mention the semi-independent Ukrainian state, you know damn well that they were not given real autonomy & the Germans never treated them as partners against the Soviets. The Ukrainians knew (((who))) was murdering them. The Ukrainians knew (((who))) was in charge in the USSR. They were happy to be liberated by the Germans. But when it became apparent that the Germans were not liberators, but new rulers, few were willing to join.

And I'll bet you that people here will tell me that Slavs are inferior and then accuse me of being a Slav (I'm German). They'll say "Slavs aren't European, they're Asiatics that should be killed"
THAT is why Hitler lost. That is nigger tire behavior. It is exactly what they Jews want and exactly what they get. Slavs fighting Germans fighting Anglos fighting French
Whites fighting Whites fighting Whites fighting Whites fighting Whites fighting Whites fighting Whites fighting Whites.

This. If Hitler had sold his Russian campaign as a fight against Communism rather than a drive eastwards for the Germanic people he would have gotten far more support from the Slavs. He might have been able to negotiate the return of Danzig without a war with Poland, and maybe even ally with them, which would give the Germans an even closer position to the USSR. Not only would it generate more support form the Slavs, the Western public would be far more sympathetic. The Western (((governments))) would have a hard time getting their people to die fighting for Communism. Even before the war the Western public saw Hitler's Germany as protection from Communism, a conquest of the USSR and liberation of Eastern Europe would have affirmed their beliefs and would have made it much harder for their governments to brainwash them into fighting Germany.

they were giving food, materials and so on.
the US didnt arm shit via lend lease on the eastern front.

wow, what a cringe post, all that typing completely discarded over a shitty cartoon webm, that webm clearly shows how much of a pathetic faggot you are.

How can you know this much and not know the Hitler Slav hatred is just another kike psyop?
Even if some Germans thought of them as lesser human beings, they were taught to treat inferiors kindly. A million Russians served the Germans in the armed forces. Could have been more if enough weapons available. Numerous Slavs fled with the Germans in the retreat west. The supposed mass graves of Slavs have never been found. And Stalin did fear rebellion, which is why he didn't just shoot people (and their families) for collaborating with the enemy, he shot people, civilians, who weren't actively fighting against the Germans. He shot you if you were cowardly enough to be taken prisoner. To help things along he made his commissars torture Germans in the most gruesome ways, then left for German troops to be found. He hoped to provoke a reaction, but the Germans didn't take the bait. Even with furious soldiers begging for revenge, the commanders kept order. So Stalin sent out his people dressed as Germans and started terrorizing his own populace.

They weren't giving the Soviets actual tanks, but those materials are the reason they could build industry and produce all the tanks they had. Without American aid the Soviets would have collapsed like Hitler thought they would.

read mein kampf.
they werent seen as complete subhumans, but rather racial adversaries.
hitler didnt want them gone from the northeuropean plain just because "muh superior race", but because of lebungsraum, and because slavs were an actual threat in the long term as they could colonise germanic land should germans see a decline in population.
think of it like the shitskin migrant invasion of today.
except this time the germans arent even fighting and the threat is much more barbaric and fatal.

the slavs in the axis armed forces were a thing of basic practicality and reason.
you wont just kill entire cities and provoke rebellion if you can recruit from them.
first hitler needed to win the war, then go on with the racial policies.

mass deportations of slavs did happen however, mostly in predicted lebungsraum in western poland, belarus and northern yugoslavia.

You realize that it was jews in the Soviet Union who wanted to exterminate all slavs, right? You realize it was jewish NKVD officers in the gulags who told the prisoners “work makes you free”, right? You realize that all the “death camps” of the “holocaust” were in soviet territory, right?
THE JEW CRIES OUT IN PAIN AS HE STRIKES YOU.

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the anglos were conditioned to hate germans before the two wars dumbass.
after the second one (((they))) saw the opportunity and made the anglo-americans their golem of choice.

Britian murdered the head of state of Greece, invaded and put some puppets in charge, directly threatening Germany’s allies Bulgaria, Hungary and Romania.
Britain made a coup in Jugoslavia as well and installed a communist dictatorship there.

Provided the oil for German tanks and planes.

Without US trucks, jeeps, rubber, railway engines and wagons, tires, leather and shoes, machinery and spares, the Soviets would have no tanks, nor fuel, nor would be able to reach the front but barefoot.

That was the plan, probably since the 1920, when Germany signed the treaty of Rapallo with the USSR and started a secret collaboration with them to rearm Germany. Something, the German-Russian alliance, the Allies never will accept and try to derail.
The allies then supported the right wing opposition in Germany to fight the “traitors”.

Stalin did know of this objective at least since the 1930’s, since his jewish cabal of spies in GB that had wormed itself into government and secret service of Britain must have informed him.
That is the background of the Molotov-Ribentrop agreement. Stalin was offered Poland (implicit the Baltic as well) by England and France (and the USA who were in Moscow at the negotiations as “neutral Observers”) if he entered the war on the allies side against Germany.
The object was to pit Germany and Russia against each other, so the allies could sweep both of them after they had exhausted them self.
That must have been known to Stalin at that time and an alliance/truce with Germany would allow him to turn that sword against the western allies, GB, France. That was also the reason Stalin was suspicious of GB and USA, all the time during the war, that they would sign a separate peace with Germany, to backstabb him.
Exactly

Oh shit you are right, they were opposed to the empire thing and pushed for universial brotherhood of man and solidarity of people, how could I have been so mislead!

You dumb polish ass, Germany made Ukraine an independent nation, as well as Finland and the Baltics and Poland too, in the first world war and in the following treaty of Brest-Litowsk.

The Ukrainians are never going to side with the pompus Polish

Hitler didn’t hate the slavs.
That is just communist propaganda.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lída_Baarová

Mussolini didn’t think much about Hitler, was opposed to him (Austria), threatened him, did believe Italy militar as superior (early on not wrong).
Mussolini worked during the first great war for British intelligence, later was killed by communist on the request of their British handlers.
Maybe just my imagination, in the pictures of Mussolini’s rescue from Mount Gran Sasso I see a “guilty-look” on Mussolini’s face, like when I have caught my dog doing something forbidden.
During the Spanish civil-war Britain collaborated with Germany, secretly supported Franco, but in and for the public created and distributed atrocity propaganda against Germany (Guernica), but not against fascist Italy. It’s quite clear that Britain wanted to keep Italy as ally, like in the first world war.

I'm not going to lie, the very least Hitler and his respective commanders could have done was expect that a massive Soviet presence would have foiled their plans.

But instead they didn't prep by giving soldiers warm clothes
didn't pack nearly enough anti-freeze
and frankly didn't bring enough men and equipment to deal with a large Soviet presence, if it were there
Which it was - they got as close as 50 miles to Moscow
They could have been smarter about it, but got too cocky and expected a Soviet retreat from Moscow.

Inb4

All I'm stating is that it could have been planned better.

The war in would probably have ended in 1942 if it wasn't for Hitlers controversial order of "not a step back" when the Russians launched their winter offensive after the battle of Moscow. All his generals panicked when the Russians attacked and they told Hitler a retreat was a must because the situation was hopeless and blah blah…. But the Hitlers order prevented the German line from breaking apart and things turn into chaos. And instead of a destruction of the Ostheer, so did the Germans turn this battle into an extremely painful loss for the Russians as their army spearheads moved so fast deeply into German occupied territory that the ran out of logictical support and became easy prey for German counter-attacks and thousands of Russian troops became encircled.
Hitler also understood the economic aspects of the war, which the German military was blind to. The modern war was much about economics. And Hitler understood the importance of Southern Russia, while his Generals didn't understand it. They simply didn't get that Germany needed oil and foodstuffs in order to win a long war, while Hitler knew that, and he also knew that the Russia needed the resources from Southern Russia as much as he did. And a loss of it would seriously harm Russia's war effort.
Finally is it worth mentioning that many of Hitlers best Generals had Hitler to thank for their career. And if the Army would have had thing as they wanted it, then the war would have been fought the old ways with old school aristocrats leeading the army instead of talented leaders with of a lower rank.
Without Hitlers promotions we would never have heard of names like Guderian, Manstein or Rommel today.
And nor would anyone have heard of Albert Speer that people talk so much about how much of a genius he was. None of these men would have done the great career they made without Hitler. Oh and about this hurr durr hitler should have treated the Slavs He did that's why Stalin implemented the Torch Men Order which declares" that Russian partisans in German uniforms, particularly those of the Waffen-SS, were to destroy all settlements within a swathe of about 40- 60 km depth from the main battle lines and to ruthlessly kill the civilian population''. With these tactics it was important to leave a few survivors, which would report the supposed German terror attacks. This method of warfare was also confirmed by German soldiers, who captured many Russian partisans wearing German uniforms.

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quality posts