I've started lurking here for the past few weeks and have been mulling over...

Jeremiah Rodriguez
Jeremiah Rodriguez

I've started lurking here for the past few weeks and have been mulling over what I've read. If I'm correct we could characterize the views of the Alt-Right, Liberals and the Left (this place) on an issue such as the low socioeconomic status of a large proportion of African-Americans like this:

Alt Right:
Niggers are inferior to muh glorious white man and hence occupy a lower rung on the social ladder, they are a burden and should be sent back(tm), they are to blame for their failure.

Liberals:
People of colour have been oppressed(tm) by white people, and have been denied opportunities to advance socieconomically as a result, we should address this by offering more opportunities to them than more muh privileged individuals and browbeating white people for being racist.

Left:
Capitalism offers low socioeconmic mobility to the working class, due to past conditions in which African-Americans were generally empoverished and heavily discriminated against, many are still trapped in this cycle in which growing up in poverty leads to the inability to escape poverty, which continues from there. This is further compounded by the fact that the poor are often corralled into inner cities with high population density that allow crime to flourish, this further stymies the potential for them to escape poverty as resorting to crime often results in more immediate rewards.

So a few questions are:
* Is the last description fairly on the ball as far as you're concerned?
* How can you address the disparity between African-Americans and Asians or other more succesful groups? Alt-right would point this out as evidence that they are inferior, Liberals would point it out as evidence that they are oppressed.
* If anything else important seems worth mentioning or was missed feel free to mention it.

Other urls found in this thread:

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_immigration_to_the_United_States
blogs.voanews.com/all-about-america/2016/04/11/why-asian-americans-are-the-most-educated-group-in-america/
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biology_and_political_orientation
marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1914/mar/11.htm
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2650118/
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3469457/
lambeth.gov.uk/rsu/sites/lambeth.gov.uk.rsu/files/The_Educational_Attainment_of_White_Working_Class_Pupils_-_Empirical_Evidence_2014.pdf
parliament.uk/business/committees/committees-a-z/commons-select/education-committee/news/white-working-class-report/
bbc.co.uk/news/education-27904204
telegraph.co.uk/men/the-filter/11965045/White-working-class-boys-are-the-worst-performing-ethnic-group-at-school.html
mega.nz/#F!DpAz2IgQ!nW7bPNnpJFk5CAV3ypiaHw
youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ

Henry Brooks
Henry Brooks

the second one

Its simply not in their self interest

Ethan Perry
Ethan Perry

Could you elaborate? Also are you referring to my second question or my basic liberal strawman for their view on the situation.

Gavin Howard
Gavin Howard

Pussy, money, weed.

Andrew Perry
Andrew Perry

How can you address the disparity between African-Americans and Asians or other more succesful groups? Alt-right would point this out as evidence that they are inferior, Liberals would point it out as evidence that they are oppressed.

Asians originally were in a similar boat to blacks, the difference is they still come over in large numbers, and new Asian immigrants are typically well off when they come here. To prove race has nothing to do with it just look at recent immigrants from Africa. They are typically better educated and better off than even the average white person.

African immigrants to the US are among the most educated groups in the United States. Some 48.9 percent of all African immigrants hold a college diploma. This is more than double the rate of native-born white Americans, and nearly four times the rate of native-born African Americans.[18] According to the 2000 Census, the rate of college diploma acquisition is highest among Egyptian Americans at 59.7 percent, followed closely by Nigerian Americans at 58.6 percent.[19][20]

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_immigration_to_the_United_States

Noah Perry
Noah Perry

Those African immigrants are owner class, educated migrants. I wouldn't that the tests from the families that were wealthy enough to come to the west as indicative of the population as a whole.

Benjamin Anderson
Benjamin Anderson

m-muh poverty is to blame!

Equality cultists actually believe this

Zachary Lopez
Zachary Lopez

Your reading comprehension is terrible.

Cameron Long
Cameron Long

Exactly. The point is to show that socioeconomic status not race is a stronger determinant of intelligence and success.

Dylan Nguyen
Dylan Nguyen

That isn't really a sound way to dismiss the claims of either group. Immigrants from less-developed countries are generally the more affluent and well educated from that nation. It would be about as effective as pointing at a handful of succesful minorities and saying "Look no problem.". Additionally, Asian Americans descended from the first Asian immigrants aren't known for living in huge inner cities and ghettos like African Americans are, you can't attribute their comparative success entirely to a more consistent level of immigration bringing in well-off individuals and families.
muh racial inferiority is to blame
Aut-rightists actually believe this.

Parker Hill
Parker Hill

At least my "belief" isn't fucking universal axiom claimed without evidence

In fact, evidence is on my side, but it takes scientists so long to come up with excuses for Autism Level gaps, failing mirror tests, the lack of high nigger societies on the entire planet, and so on.

Samuel Butler
Samuel Butler

Poverty can lower individuals Autism Level by 15 points.

Blake White
Blake White

the economic structure of society and its ideological edifice ends where my feelings begin

Owen Peterson
Owen Peterson

Ok, would you care to explain how the poor are intended to escape from poverty in the conditions I described? Would you care to explain why similar regions full of poor white people living off welfare/shit jobs exist in America and other countries from which nearly no one escapes? I'm not saying these people are necessarily just like you and me but black and poor. They're often uneducated and stupid due simply to where they were raised, which limits their access to eduaction or educated individuals, and may foster an anti-intellectual mindset or contempt for education and the more successful that further cripples them.

It's an entirely logical vicious cycle type argument, there are similar areas in Britain where people living off welfare shit out little white kids. What do you think the prospects for these kids are? They get raised by parents who are dumb as a post, often have no aspirations and are happy to just watch TV all day and eat shit food while leeching off the welfare state, all their peers will be in the same boat, the areas they are in are poor, every possible factor is pitted against these kids every achieving anything. Unsurprisingly despite their SUPERIOR WHITE HERITAGE(TM) very few of these people advance on the socioeconomic scale.

Charles Morales
Charles Morales

At least my beliefs are based on massively inflating whatever scraps the scientific community throws my way and never letting go of it, even after some of it has been debunked and in complete denial of the fact that the scientific community, while acknowledging that people have different genetics, doesn't believe that the modern concept of race is in any way a good measure of mapping those differences.

Parker Evans
Parker Evans

Niggers are still dumber even when you adjust it to poverty. They commit more crime when adjusted to poverty. The list goes on.

The genes that make people violent have already been isolated and found in abundance in niggers but not white people.

But wait!
genes are spooks XDXDXD

James Kelly
James Kelly

Proof?

Josiah Sanchez
Josiah Sanchez

Genes aren't spooks, also do you have a single source to back up your assertion that "the violent gene" has been found in Black people?

Secondly, it's evident that White people commit more crime than Asians even when adjusted for poverty, clearly we should all exterminate ourselves and bow down to the master race.

William Young
William Young

If blacks are more violent why did whites do the holocaust?

Lucas Long
Lucas Long

Additionally, Asian Americans descended from the first Asian immigrants aren't known for living in huge inner cities and ghettos like African Americans are

That's because they've been overshadowed by the steady stream of well off immigrants from Asian countries. There are still good sized swaths of the Asian population that live in poverty.

A 2010 report focusing on Asians in California — a state with the highest U.S. Asian population outside of Hawaii — found that expectation to be false. In California, for example, 45 percent of Hmong, 40 percent of Cambodians and Laotians, and one-fifth of Fijians had less than a high school education.

blogs.voanews.com/all-about-america/2016/04/11/why-asian-americans-are-the-most-educated-group-in-america/

They also have a significant presence in the world of organized crime in the form of the Triads, Yakuza, Korean gangs, etc.

Camden Wilson
Camden Wilson

This. Jews and Asians are proven to be more intelligent than all other races. Everybody else belongs in the oven.

Ryan Moore
Ryan Moore

Alright nice, that's getting somewhere.

Dylan Gonzalez
Dylan Gonzalez

Aut-right/fascists don't merely blame nonwhites for their own problems as much as they incapable of even seeing them as people that can have problems, and tend to blame them for everyone else's. Same with liberals in reverse, honestly.

Neither of these people even believe in socioeconomics. They think reality runs on feelings.

Daniel Wilson
Daniel Wilson

"A study by scientists at New York University and the University of California, Los Angeles, found differences in how self-described liberal and conservative research participants responded to changes in patterns.[12] Participants were asked to tap a keyboard when the letter "M" appeared on a computer monitor and to refrain from tapping when they saw a "W." The letter "M" appeared four times more frequently than "W," conditioning participants to press the keyboard on almost every trial. Liberal participants made fewer mistakes than conservatives when they saw the rare "W," indicating to the researchers that these participants were better able to accept changes or conflicts in established patterns. The participants were also wired to an electroencephalograph that recorded activity in their anterior cingulate cortex, the part of the brain that detects conflicts between a habitual tendency and a more appropriate response. Liberals were significantly more likely than conservatives to show activity in the brain circuits that deal with conflicts during the experiment, and this correlated with their greater accuracy in the test."
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biology_and_political_orientation

it's funny to see you go full triggered and denial to facts as soon as they don't fit your narrative
which of course is explained by the lack of cognitive abilities

Christian Long
Christian Long

now, here's the adult way to adress "Equality":

Mr. Tugan repeats the old trick of the reactionaries: first to misinterpret socialism by making it out to be an absurdity, and then to triumphantly refute the absurdity! When we say that experience and reason prove that men are not equal, we mean by equality, equality in abilities or similarity in physical strength and mental ability.

It goes without saying that in this respect men are not equal. No sensible person and no socialist forgets this. But this kind of equality has nothing whatever to do with socialism. If Mr. Tugan is quite unable to think, he is at least able to read; were lie to Lake the well-known work of one of the founders of scientific socialism, Frederick Engels, directed against Dühring, he would find there a special section explaining the absurdity of imagining that economic equality means anything else than the abolition of classes. But when professors set out to refute socialism, one never knows what to wonder at most—their stupidity, their ignorance, or their unscrupulousness.
marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1914/mar/11.htm

Xavier Morales
Xavier Morales

How can you address the disparity between African-Americans and Asians or other more succesful groups? Alt-right would point this out as evidence that they are inferior, Liberals would point it out as evidence that they are oppressed.

Asians did not have the same treatment, simple as that. Most Asians in the US descent from people that were much better off and came by their own volition.

Besides, the state of the black community has been rapidly improving from a purely racial perspective: higher education rates, lower crime rates, etc, with no projected end thus far. Inferior beings do not magically stop being inferior.

Jacob Bennett
Jacob Bennett

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2650118/

triggered lol

Adam Ramirez
Adam Ramirez

No seriously why did whites do the holocaust if blacks are so violent?

Jaxson Cruz
Jaxson Cruz

n-no you!

Tyler Robinson
Tyler Robinson

I see no mention of differeing levels of the gene in Blacks in that article.

Daniel Rodriguez
Daniel Rodriguez

kek

Kevin Richardson
Kevin Richardson

Low activity MAOA is likely caused epigenetically.

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3469457/

In addition, it only leads to increased aggression in times of distress, which is why it only correlates with having a troubled childhood. In other words, material conditions.

On top of all of this being the fact that among US citizens, where the sample sizes all come from, violent crime has been decreasing for decades with no end in sight. Genetics do not work like that.

William Morales
William Morales

The warrior gene is only triggered by certain environmental conditions, which is consistent with what most behaviour scientists have determined. Behaviour is a combination of conditions and environment, the only question is to what extent each plays a role.

Alexander Richardson
Alexander Richardson

no you don't get it
genes are magical and they make you do things without any reason whatsoever. just because you say that it makes people do things under certain conditions only, doesn't mean that the inherent gene magic will make them do things under any and all conditions.
just like i am superior without even doing anything.

Tyler Roberts
Tyler Roberts

nazis are so fucking stupid I didn't notice it was satire at first

Noah Barnes
Noah Barnes

All niggers are dumb and violent
But its not a universal axiom

I know you are fucking dumb, but still

Isaiah Peterson
Isaiah Peterson

nice gulagposting

Justin Robinson
Justin Robinson

White working class have the worst educational attainment out of all ethnic groups within the UK.

lambeth.gov.uk/rsu/sites/lambeth.gov.uk.rsu/files/The_Educational_Attainment_of_White_Working_Class_Pupils_-_Empirical_Evidence_2014.pdf

parliament.uk/business/committees/committees-a-z/commons-select/education-committee/news/white-working-class-report/

bbc.co.uk/news/education-27904204

telegraph.co.uk/men/the-filter/11965045/White-working-class-boys-are-the-worst-performing-ethnic-group-at-school.html

Care to explain…? Or perhaps you think that Anglos are non-white :^)

Ryder Price
Ryder Price

First of all, I think that the left acknowledges the fact that race is a factor, if only by virtue of social class and social behavior is related to communities and modern day America does most certainly have racial communities. Most leftists also seem to acknowledge racial tension as a status quo class tension that benefits the ruling class.
How can you address the disparity between African-Americans and Asians or other more succesful groups?
Remember that you're speaking about a specific situation and a specific subset of people, not a general picture across the world here.
In addition to what other people in the thread was discussing before they including me got baited into talking about Autism Level again, I think it's useful to just look at the historical picture, which shows that Asians e.g. was
1. Not subjugated to the same degree as African-Americans originally, and
2. Did not suffer under the same segregative laws and institutions which disenfranchised and disadvantaged blacks to a larger degree.

However, no controlled experimental studies have tested whether the warrior gene actually drives behavioral manifestations of these tendencies.
Do you even read the shit you link? This is in the fucking abstract.
And also even if that is the fucking case, you - like every other nazi I've seen on this board - have still yet to argue why that warrants different treatment. Fucking at the very least just read the fucking SEP article on the is-ought gap.

Dylan Clark
Dylan Clark

anglos
white

Dylan Cruz
Dylan Cruz

A 2010 report focusing on Asians in California — a state with the highest U.S. Asian population outside of Hawaii — found that expectation to be false. In California, for example, 45 percent of Hmong, 40 percent of Cambodians and Laotians, and one-fifth of Fijians had less than a high school education.

That's the problem with grouping every ethnic group with origins east of Pakistan and west of the West Coast as "Asians".

Hunter Sanders
Hunter Sanders

Pussy,money,weed

Landon Wright
Landon Wright

I don't think there's any country in Europe where the working-classes have been so consistently shat on outside the UK.

The problem when discussing things like this it always gets argued down to an either/or situation - either the environment is 100% responsible for everything, and if you disagree with that statement then you obviously believe genes are 100% responsible for everything.

There's no room for any sort of middle ground because chucklefucks start shrieking about gas chambers and forced sterilisation

Caleb Morales
Caleb Morales

That's a nice statement to use against an argument like this too. It can even make them feel guilt for lumping the people together like that without using their own arguments against them.

Jonathan Garcia
Jonathan Garcia

The problem is that when people talk about "Asian-Americans" as a model minority, they're really just talking about Indian/Korean/Chinese/Japanese-Americans, not the census/government definition of "Asian-American" (i.e. anyone descending from ethnic groups deriving from Oceania, or Asia sans Russia/the Middle East)

Same as the average person definition of "white" is probably very different to the census/government definition (i.e. which includes Middle Easterners, North Africans and any Hispanic that considers themselves white)

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