ITT: Casual filters

boards.4chan.org/v/
reddit.com/

Take your pick.

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Seeing people unable to grasp simple probability is incredibly amusing.

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A casual filter doesn't have to be difficulty, it just has to filter out casuals. Morrowind for example, the combat is very easy but serves as a casual filter by making poorly built characters or fatigued characters miss most of their attacks. Which can be avoided by taking a minute to think about your build… something a casual won't do. Thus, a casual filter.

I guess, but EYE's only real "filter" would just be front-loading a shit ton of information with no explanation.

Hi reddit

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It's not a causal filter if it sucks anyway

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Yeah, you really need to go back.

EYE sucks tbh

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Any grand strategy game probably qualifies.

Trying a bit too hard reddit.

what are you smoking and where can I get some

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I thi nk you are the one who needs to go back if you dont like duke or DOOM.

Like clockwork

Where did yours go, faggot?

(1)
They are trash.

I, too, can post meaningless bullshit.

the original deus ex wasn't that good of a game. shooting is inarguably terrible, dice rolls have no reason to be involved with that and it's terribly unfun to use any weapon in the game except explosives. The level design is very sloppy, never really reaching any highs at any point, and often dipping into absolute shit territory. The stealth is a joke compared to some of the games that inspired it, namely thief. The skill leveling system is pretty uninteresting. Some of the augs are good. Narrative shaping around some of your actions in the first few hours of the game is a neat gimmick but just a gimmick.

overrated shit in the end

The game is pretty easy when you get how parring works, but I've seen a lot of my friends getting themselves killed easily because of this same parry system.

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Better watch out, might just call you out for that (1) user.

probably RWBY: Grimm Eclipse itself, It's so bad, awful and exclusive to the worst tastes, that bothering to finishing, itself is a casual filter as you're engrossed with disgust

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kek

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Fite me u cunt

I've played better games with similar level design ideas from before memeus ex

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They may as werll be console trash, redditor.

Are you the same fag from yesterday who called almost everyone in the thread a redditor? Please, at least come up with something else, it stops having as much impact when you start overusing it.

What the fuck is all this, and why did I save them?

Horse left the barn on that one a long time ago.

This coming from a teenager who jumped on the "Thief is the only good stealth game ever made" bandwagon?

yeah it's on the same level as nigger, faggot, and cuck at this point. nobody cares. they're probably half the userbase at this point anyway.

t. nigger faggot cuck redditor :^)

(you)

A good RPG makes combat more dependent on character skill than player skill. DX1 largely does this though I'd agree the stealth and enemy AI, in particular, could use some work.
At the end of the day DX1 is not and FPS, it's a FPRPG (or if you like an FPS/RPG). Shooting is a secondary concern compared to role-playing.

The level design is one of the best things about DX1. Hell the 'do shit your own way' stuff is almost entirely reliant upon it.

Thief 1 and 2 are not the only good stealth games but they are the pinnacle of (3D) stealth. No other game compares and that's a fucking disgrace.

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Hit a nerve?

That's really the same attitude I was talking about.

Aye, but there was a thread where nearly every post that user made had at least 2 instances of redditor.

Nigger and faggot are hardly even insults on imageboards, though. It used to bother me when people started using cuck in cases where it really made no sense but I'm beyond caring about it now.

making the shooting such a secondary aspect to give the lackluster rpg elements more meaning by crippling the way the player engages with the mechanics is an absolutely horrendous solution to the problem. There could have been more meaningful RPG choices, such as player skills beyond just augmentations and not just hurr you aim in 2 seconds instead of in 12. This is awful design because the abstraction to give the mechanic more meaning to the player is at best, lining up the shot, and waiting, just fucking waiting, doing nothing while you wait so you can pull the trigger and see it hit.

This is indefensible and is a bad way to justify why the game is an RPG. System Shock 2 had a better solution to the same problem a year in advance. Pathetic that Deus Ex didn't learn from it.

The level design is empty cuboids with some occasional props littering the inbetweens for cover between you and enemies. Corridors, cuboids, and ventilation shafts. At times it does some meaningful changes to the game play such as the spider bots for stealth players to concern themselves with (although the implementation isn't as good as it could be) but this is basic deviation for the sake of variety and increased challenge.

The way the choices in the level design feels so compartmentalzied, with obvious stealth only routes, obvious run'n'gun routes, and obvious in-between routes doesn't benefit the game much at all. The best point I can think of for this sort of diversifying of options was in hell's kitchen on the NSF base, very early in the game. The rooftop, sewer, and frontal assault methods are all rather meaningfully differentiated. The actual base is rather enjoyable to explore, although is unfortunately very small.

The game does deserve some praise for attempting this, but I rarely see it criticized as anything but the fucking messiah of gaming since the late 00's to today.

just giving you the attention you crave, you non-contributing zero

It's not an attitude it's simply a summary of the situation. Don't get me wrong there are plenty of other good stealth games and even a few great ones (e.g. Chaos Theory and the rather surprising Styx) but they simply are not as good. Usage of sound is a large part of it because a lot of these games seems to have followed on from MGS which really just applied MG's 2D approach to stealth.

I'd love to see a stealth game to equal the first two Thiefs or even beat them but sadly a lot of the work they did for those games was buried with the closure of LGS so it has to be done from scratch and that requires a big budget. I seem to remember some cunt buying up the rights to an even more advance set of sound tech they were making and refusing to license it out to anyone. Pure stealth is also a niche genre and autists are hard to make significant money from.

yeah, i get it, thats the new meme you casuls use when you get triggered

WHY

WELLLLLLLL

A post having a lot of text doesn't mean it has a lot of content, in the same way that a level having a lot of elements doesn't make it complex. The "obvious" and "compartmentalized" level routes can easily be dismissed by your lack of imagination. Thank you for at least attempting to sound like you know what you're talking about, though.

The pinnacle of the stealth genre would have decent enemy AI and would not have entire missions which could be scrapped, there are enough flaws to dethrone Thief from the king of the hill to just another good stealth game.

???

I can dismiss you faster if you want kid

Underrated post.

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Holy shit you are fucking thirsty, thank you for the contribution you oversensitive faggot.

Better than making the shooting the central focus to the detriment of RP. DX1's shooting isn't that terrible anyway compared even to modern attempts at combining the two genres. TES, Mass Effect and even HR tried to improve combat and still ended up with sub-par combat and less focus on RP. You must sacrifice a lot to gain a small benefit.

That was tried in VTM:B and it can work but augmentations essentially are the skills you describe. It's just that you don't use XP to get them. XP itself is just an abstraction of greater experience and not necessarily the best way to deal with skills, increasing power etc.

Welcome to being a shit shot. Perhaps a better solution would have been giving you more points to play (as is common in, say, TES) with at the start but Denton was supposed to be new at this shit.

SS2's combat isn't really much better.

Do you have any idea how game development works? You can't overhaul fundamental gameplay elements in under a year from release.

A lack of prettiness does not make the level design sloppy, doubly so when you consider the age of the game. And to claim it only occasionally offers meaningful gameplay options is bullshit. Name one game which consistently does a better job at it.

This was true of IW and HR but not DX1. You are rarely, if ever, forced to be stealthy if you chose a stealth route. Also there are invariably multiple routes for each style not simply 'door or vents'. It's just that these are not marked clearly as it's on the player to find them.

While I do think it deserves a place in the top 10 of all time at the very least I'll agree it is not critized for what it did wrong. VTM:B and Alpha Protocol expanded on it and in many ways improved the formula.

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Third world internet took four minutes to upload the mp4, huh? At least you're proving that you aren't upset.

Roll two dice, one of them comes up six. What are the odds both of them are six?

1/6 because the first one already stopped

The AI isn't particularly bad though it does rather show its age in some areas and is probably the largest complaint with the game. I do like little touches like them still briefly being vulnerable from the front if you quickly jump out but it's too easy to draw them into traps others have died in (common to most stealth games). As for 'missions that could be scrapped' I'd be interested to hear which ones and why. Personally I'd remove Thieves' Guild from T1 (a Gold mission anyway) but otherwise the missions are varied enough I can't call any one of them filler.

So which stealth game is the new king?

mehtall geer soild xDDD

Right, shouldn't have been included in the second release in the first place, and Mage Towers can go while we're at it. Casing the Joint didn't need to be a separate mission in T2, and the first trip to the cathedral in T1 is equally uneventful. There's also the one where you follow the bloodstains through the forest in T2, off the top of my head.

Why does there need to be one? You already mentioned Chaos Theory and Styx, there's also Blood Money and Silent Assassin, or Death to Spies II, there isn't any more reason to say those games reach untold heights over Thief than vice versa.

I was gonna take a nap but I want to address a few things

the opposite would have made the game more fun. better to have more meaningful RPG elements instead of crippling ones just so you can say "my games also an RPG!" Like, who cares? If it doesn't make it better, it's not a good thing.

modern solutions aren't great, but they're a bit better. Dice rolls are a bad idea for most games. Sacrificing a lot for this small "benefit" isn't worth it.

it was always a little weird being fresh off an academy that trained cops but having the aim of an 8 year old with progeria.

the combat's a little better, the RPG implementation is far better. Gating off tiers of weapons behind skill levels instead of just making every weapon terribly unfun to use because it's a part of a different classification.

this is what made me postpone my nap and reply. Do you know much about the history of Deus Ex? It had some very rocky development. According to Warren Spector, Harvey Smith saved the entire project in the last 6 months up to release by overhauling almost every single game mechanic, including the RPG skill point system. You should check out some of the many postmortems on it.

when you think about it, it's running on the same engine that produced Unreal, so that excuse doesn't fly. Thief also has better, more organic looking levels. It gets even worse when you consider what some games were doing 6 months, or even a year after it came out. DX1 was also heavily criticized at launch for how ugly it was compared to even half-life.
dark messiah was great although enemies sure tanked damage which made the instant kill traps far more appealing and prevalent than they should have been.

I agree it was far worse in HR, but it was very present in the original. The differentiation was just a bit more natural at times.

I think I could find a spot for it in a top 50, but not in a top 10. There are far better games out there.

I know the context. You use it when you don't like what someone says and they conveniently have only one post in the thread. It was originally used to spot shills.

also >(1)

VTMB Sewers

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wat
seriously, wat? How is this a casual filter? I don't get it

But Memeus Ex isn't a bandwagon? How do I hypocrisy?

I'd prefer it be reworked a bit. It's got some interesting ideas but it doesn't work so well on a replay and frankly it's a bit easy for where it's positioned in the game.

Fair enough though it does help it feel more like you're doing things more like a classic thief doing his recon.

Nigger you have to move through a haunted city. Deeply enjoyable.

Another one I'd agree with though again I think it needs a rework.

Even if we remove all of those that's ~5 missions over two games, two of which are fairly short.

If it's no longer the pinnacle there needs to be a superior game. Chaos Theory, though I love it, will never be as great because linearity no matter how well executed is inferior to the more open levels of Thief. It also doesn't scale up as well to higher difficulties nor have as interesting/original a setting or use sound quite as well.

Blood Money, Silent Assasin and Contracts all have their flaws and for my money Death to Spies II is probably superior to them. A hypothetical version of Death to Spies with a lot of polish and expanded mechanics would be the tits but sadly Alekhine's Gun was ass.

Pretty much the entire game. Though if I had to pick one point in it, I'd say the second 3 stooges fight.

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geez, you wouldn't know it from the daily threads dedicated to the game on here

Sneaking through a haunted city would be deeply enjoyable, moving through a haunted city is something I can do in a lot of games.

I did say off the top of my head. Do you want me to go through all 31 missions between the two games? I'll do it.

I have no problem saying that The Dark Project is superior to Chaos Theory, the original claim was that no other game compares. I also have no problem saying that with the right level pack, The Dark Mod is superior to TDP.

I've given you a bunch of examples of games that try the route of standard shooting and RPG shit. They all either become shooters pretending to be RPGs or worse RPGs with shooting that's still boring. STALKER might buck that trend somewhat but it isn't a full on RPG so that's your best case scenario here.

Where are the Dice rolls in DX1, out of interest? I can't think of any. Perhaps you mean the shooting but it doesn't roll a dice to see if you hit it simply gives you parkinson's. Additionally dice rolls can work in an RPG if it isn't extremely random.

Well you can stick enough points into handguns to make yourself halfway competent. Average police also are reliably terrible with handguns in real life with American police often hitting bystanders or missing entirely. The stress of actual combat is different from shooting on a range.

Being unskilled with a gun doesn't prevent you from using it, doubly so given Denton's basic training.

I'm aware of it's crazy development though I wasn't aware of it being overhauled so heavily in 6 months which, to be fair, is the exception rather than the rule in the vidya industry. They could then have taken ideas from SS2 but again SS2's combat was not significantly better than DX1 and it compares unfavourable in other ways.

Unreal's levels are not really as detailed as DX1's. Prettier, perhaps, but that isn't what matters in an RPG.

Which are emptier and doubly so if you do not count loot. It's also a little blockier.

Again looking bad =/= bad level design. From a gameplay perspective DX1's levels are fine-brilliant.

DMoMM does not offer as many routes nor is it as consistent at offering them. It does do a good job at it particularly in comparison to even HR and much better than its genre standard. It does look better in terms of graphical prettiness but so what?

I struggle to think of 10 games that are better than it. Possibly if you love certain genres.

How you play is up to you. Don't turn on the lights and sneaking is valid.

Why not? Remember we're not talking flaws in missions we're talking missions so flawed or unnecessary they should be removed. And again some of those 5 missions are in my opinion merely in need of a rework not removal. Casing the Joint is a great idea poorly executed, for example. I'd say T2 probably has more objectionable missions despite being the better game overall.

I still don't think any game comes close, more or less the definition of 'does not compare'.
Fair enough though TDM is an unofficial Thief game as far as I'm concerned. I don't like TDM's setting as much (obviously they could not use the official IP) but gameplay wise it's pretty great.

I have a feeling that anyone who thinks Deus Ex is a top 10 game only played it on the easiest difficulty.

The game's whole gimmick is that it offers the player "choice"… except that on hard you don't have one: the game becomes "Thief: Lightsabers and Vents Edition" with garbage stealth. The RPG mechanics are System Shock 2 tacked onto a game that really doesn't want or need it. The choices in the story make no real difference other than some gimmicks.

Overall it's a bland, shitty shooter where every single mechanic is done poorly. Thief, System Shock, and even Human Revolution are superior games.

Considering we're at 5 out of 31 (one out of every six missions) I think that's a healthy enough number to make my point, but sure, I'll look at the rest.

The Gold version of The Lost City had no business being in the game, since that's the version of the list we're going with, it had half of its content gutted. The Sword falls into the category of "flaws in missions" so it gets a pass, but I will say I think it's easily three times bigger than it needed to be to accomplish its goal, other levels feel more labyrinthine without trying so hard. Escape! is another that didn't need to be a separate mission. Trace the Courier is a pretty boring reiteration of the first half of Assassins and didn't need to be included either. Name another one from T2 you think is objectionable and we're well past the 1/4th mark, approaching 1/3rd of the levels.

Get good.

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Cheesing with explosives means you are bad at the game and need to get good, I understand this is complicated.

The realistic difficulty is much more entertaining though and not particularly difficult to shoot in. It does, in fact, make the AI take more damage as well as your character. Hard on the other hand is indeed stealth only but why would you play that?

Why? The biggest flaw to me is the lack of a non-lethal requirement but otherwise it's not much different.

The point of the Sword is how fucked up the the mansion is. The corridors at the end did annoy me a bit. If you include Little Big World then yes, it's a bit excessive, but that's more of an easter egg than a legitimate part of the level.

The game would be just as long if it were rolled into the previous mission. Given that you lose your equipment, the entire level changes and the storyline is different why the hell shouldn't it be a separate mission? I wouldn't want to replay Haunted Cathedral's scavenger hunt if I just wanted to replay Esacpe!.

Agreed. They didn't even keep the target following one of multiple paths thing. I still think most of the levels you've mentioned are merely flawed rather than outright removable particularly for a first time player.

How can you be bad at DX1?

It had half of its content gutted! I played the Gold version first and outright hated that mission until I played the Dark Project version of it. The Song of the Caverns is fine, but it wasn't worth making 50% of the lost city worthless filler.

It's not all that fucked up in the end, it just looks that way. A hallway's still a hallway even if it's twisted, a door's still a door even if it's upside-down. If the point of the level was to make it fucked up they should have spent less time making it big and more time making it weird.

Is it all that much better that a third of the levels are flawed for the game to be called the incomparable pinnacle of stealth?

Surprised no one's mentioned him

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Lucky for you we're all user here, or this would be really embarrassing.

Does anyone have the video of the major game reviewers trying and failing miserably to get through the Cragscleft mines?

I may have to go and replay them both then. It's been a long, long time since I played the non-Gold version.

It's not that big. Also I still don't think it's worth removing. You must remember that playing it a second, third or fourth time isn't like the first time and the first time it's supposed to be a shock and a complete change in what you're used to. It was effective at that for me anyway.

Thief (or more accurately the Thief 'trilogy', TDM included) is the pinnacle not because it's perfect but because no other game has really even tried to beat it. Some games have taken parts of what Thief did and done those parts better than the original but none have attempted to improve the entire formula at once. It needs an ambitious developer with a large budget and no need to pander to anyone beyond a niche, extremely hard to please audience some of whom are going to disregard anything out of nostalgia. Why would anyone but the most autistic fans (i.e. TDM) want to bother?

I would someone posting this video. 'Journalists' are so reliably terrible at vidya it's hilarious.

Came here to post this.

Nigger what
that guy was easy as shit to beat

I know this is what you actually want so here

In the original version, finding the Talisman of Water wasn't its own mission, you found both that and the Talisman of Fire in the Lost City. For the Gold version they removed the Talisman of Water and put it in the Song of the Caverns instead, but that's all they did, they just removed the item. So the whole section of the lost city dedicated to finding the talisman goes unused unless you wander there accidentally. Really, really rubs me the wrong way.

For this to be true the Thief games would have to represent the consummate stealth game formula, and I'm not convinced that it does. Just for one example, you chastised Splinter Cell earlier for having linear levels, but how does that negate stealth? Having a linear sequence of encounters instead of a relatively open level full of circuitous guard routes can allow for more tightly-designed stealth challenges.

He's easy if you're a sorcerer anyway, that's how I beat him.

is that deus ex? that fucking statue still haunts me to this day

I'm aware of the change I just never felt it to be a huge issue. Granted I only played the original game through once and I was rather young at the time. A good while later I tried Gold and that's what I've mostly played. Being used to it can hide flaws which is why I asked what missions you disliked (always good to hear other user's thoughts).

I actually think linearity works very well in SC 1 and CT and isn't a bad thing in and of itself as good linearity need not be locked down. It's just that the more open missions of Thief are the superior stealth experience when combined with the whole stealth package that Thief has.

SC with Thief style levels would not work and Thief with SC style levels would also not work. At the end of the day the Thief style is superior but both work in their own way.

He was easy as shit for me to beat to but I swear to fuck every single time I talk to somebody about BBI they always mention that he's bullshit. Hence I figure, casual filter

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Casuals are always complaining about Rainbow Road, no matter what version.

That one bandit up the mountain to the left of the encampment with a sword and shield

You know the one

Bandits felt so awkward to fight compared to the monster. May I am the casul, but it's clear what kind of fights DD was made for and groups of NPCs with player abilities are not among them.

I've played at least 400 hours of the game and I can assure you that you aren't necessarily a casul for believing that. Bandits are one of the most annoying and least fun enemies in the game to fight.

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I never understood this. Usually rainbow road is my favorite in every entry. I'm guessing its because of the lack or rails.

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why would they ruin a perfectly good demon?

I feel like I'm the only one who shat all over Monsoon my first go. What gets me is that Sundowner completely walked all over me, the boss everyone says is an easy bitch. I have an incredibly aggressive playstyle in every game I touch, and he can punish that hard.

You can still be aggressive, you just need to react to him chucking his shields down.

I am so mad right now

And these people dare call themselves "games journalists"

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You are both wrong. This guy on the first visit to Everfall unless you take the way around and fight a shitload of fireball spamming skeletons and harpies over incredibly slim and partially ruined overhangs which is a casual filter on its own especially if you play on hard.

Well unless the AI causes the ogre to charge off a cliff and kill himself anyways.

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lel

Nah since as you said he can jump off the cliff and die instantly the REAL casual filter are the THREE OGRES YOU HAVE TO FIGHT IN THE MINE.
Jesus, those horny fuckers still give me trouble on new playthroughs.

It almost feels like he's programmed to do that because i've done like four playthroughs and he's leapt to his death every time

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

He's only done it for me twice. The trick is when he runs right at you stay by the edge to when he does his dive dropkick he flies the fuck off. Bonus points if you grab him afterwards and ride him off the edge and right before he hits the ground jump off him and land safely like some troll science shit.

Best casual filter. 1 easy step.

If no, then casual garbage.

Also, fucking Elder Ogres. Not exactly a casual filter but kind of like a final exam in 'have you been minmaxing properly'

I don't know, who are you ?

Conquerors periapts dog.
Stack 4 of them and whoop his ass.

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I know you are but what am I?

Kinda want to post AAA games because only casuals play them.
sage for funpost~

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I thought he was pretty easy all you needed to do was block hit him with the 3 hit combo then use flesh skewer and after that you keep hitting him while he`s on the ground. Rinse repeat

tbh those two images are nothing but autism and try hard le funny.

GDI Sarajevo on 1.09, this mission was pretty easy on release but the devs kept fucking with the multiplayer balance so much that it affected the way some singleplayer missions play out.

for me it's the eye sore more than difficulty. there is that one blind hill, and it's obnoxious when attacks send you over the side. pushy penguins are worse though.

This entire game is fucking hell for people that have shit memory or sense of direction

This guy. To this day I'm having problems with him on higher difficulties.

Bethesda games.

My pawn told me they're left exposed after a grand strike, so i just ran around his attack and hit him in his recovery animation. The only annoying part was running around reviving my pawns

The few people I know who played this game quit or had lots of trouble with this boss.

Also the basic or advanced tutorial is the casual filter for this game, if steam reviews are to be believed. muh no jump button

I didn't enjoy it.

I mean, I played it and I get why some people may enjoy it but it's not my thing.
Too french for my taste, so to speak.

every thread

RELEVANT

Don't mind him; OP just saw the latest Ross's Game Dungeon. Nice digits btw.

Warframe. The entire game.

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I loved Dark Messiah but different routes between "stealth backstab murder" and fuck everyone's shit up murder sprees with magic and/or brawling throughout the exact same path isn't really the same or similar enough for a comparison. Especially when you can talk your out of most situations and actually just skip ahead if you bothered to remember the passwords, only two-three people are mandatory to kill and you can skip all three of them if you wanted to. Dark Messiah only has three key branching points and absolutely no change anywhere else the rest is just straight up action even the one pseudo hub is just a nice touch to serve as a prelude before you just go down action lane.

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In solo

Check these and all will be revealed.

Not even joking.

how was this hard?

fuck off

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Eh, I like EYE, but I it isn''t really a casual filter.

Friend of mine owned this sonofabitch and he kicked quite a bit of ass at it, but the one boss who would always throttle his shit was the fucking Lucha gorilla.

It had to have been because he would grab a lot and the input to get out of a grab is so different from everything else you normally do.

Well, anyone with any actual grasp of the game could beat him, but before that,

Barroth from Vanilla Tri

He's nerfed to hell in 3U, but in vanilla? holy shit.

You're fighting easy as fuck jaggi and noisy bird and shit and it's all so easy, you won't be oneshot by even some of their stronger attacks.

Then this fucker shows up.

The tone shift between fighting those other monsters and fighting this fucker caused a hell of a lot of people to either git gud or quit.

How to spot a thread full of millenials

shit thread

I'm guessing you mean getting used to how the game played as a whole.

Otherwise i assume you mean this motherfucker.

GRIM SLASHER
BONE DUSTER

As someone who has put 400 hours into this game I can assure you that minmaxing isn't nearly that important. You can put 200 levels into sorcerer and still do ok as a fighter. Is it ideal? No, but if you can beat BBI from the start of the game without going anywhere else then you can also beat it with unoptimized stats. I think you were just neglecting to upgrade your weapons.

The real casual is anyone who posts in this thread. Hahahahahaha!

Wait….

The post upstairs is merely pretending to be a casual.

definitely this

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If you flip a coin when sleeping beauty goes to bed what are the chances of there being a goat in the other door?

I swear, the AI partners were fucking with me the entire game.

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Well, shit. Now I need to go play crazy taxi. I hope you're fucking happy with yourself.

or maybe you could post a fun game