JRPG Thread: Sega Edition

I no the original tied everything up nicely, but that setting had so much potential. Maybe a prequel could work?

Other urls found in this thread:


Oh, I'd been hoping for a JRPG thread soon. The one a while back was pretty nice.

Honestly, at this point I wouldn't trust Sega to be able to do the game right by a sequel. Does surprise me a bit that Vyse gets occasional cameos in stuff like VC and that Sonic Racing game.

Is Panzer Dragoon Saga actually good or is it that thing where Sega fans were so starved everything seemed amazing? Also is it necessary to play the first 2 Panzer Dragoon games beforehand?

Not even. Go the Wild Arms route. Similar setting, similar themes, entirely new casts, change up some combat mechanics, etc.

Also, we can't have a Sega JRPG thread without Shining Force.

True. Maybe they could just publish it and get someone else to develop the game?

It is good, very few games capture the feeling of being all alone in a desolate world as well, but it's not worth the crazy prices people charge for it. An no, you don't need to have played the first two games.

That would be ideal.

Or you know. The sequel could just be the same setting but a completely different era with different factions and such to drive a different plot.

Oh the price isn't an issue I actually have a working Saturn with a modchip in it. I'll probably still buy that HDD card if it ever goes on sale though.

Wild Arms is an odd case, in that all the games are technically standalone with recurring elements (I still think WA3 takes place after WA1/ACF due to the sheer amount of them), but Media.Vision has always been wishy washy about whether it's the same Filgaia/timeline each time, or alternate universe each game. I doubt they'll ever confirm whether it is or isn't. It's enough they had a cameo NPC in WA5 speculate on it.

On a related note:
Not sure what I was expecting from them really.

Shame Sega outright lost the code for PDS and there's never been a rerelease.

What the fuck that's not the image I posted. How has the image swapping issue still not been worked out?

Well you should definitely play it then. It's one of, if not the best RPG on the Saturn.

How well does PDS emulate these days anyhow? Though I suppose since I'm on a toaster for the time being, I'm not going to be able to play it for a while.

I can't help but feel Sega was stupid to not only ship so few copies west (admittedly the Saturn didn't do nearly as well here as in Japan, to my knowledge anyhow), but then mocked potential customers that couldn't find copies of it. And now it's like a good $350-400 last I saw it locally a few years back.

For the guy to get the Saturn to read hard drives he had to dump one of the Saturn's CPUs. He said that he is going to share this with Emulator developers which should actually greatly improve the emulation performance. Apparently the Saturn CPUs are still essentially black boxes except for the one this guy dumped.

Is that guy going to need to crack more of them, or whatever he's had to do in order to dump them? I mean, just how much of a boon is having a single one having been dumped going to be? Maybe I'm remembering wrong, but didn't the Saturn have like six CPUs, or some other parts, that's hampered emulation quality?

Regardless, I have to wonder, had Sega not fucking lost the game's code, could they have potentially made a rerelease for the PSN or a port or something? Strikes me that not enough companies have made the most out of the digital rerelease format in helping people be able to play classics again (that they don't want to, or in some cases can't, emulate). I can at least give Konami and Capcom credit where it's due for finally getting around to tossing Suikoden II, MML2, and Tron Bonne on the PSN.

As far as I can tell it emulates pretty well on SSF, though I get the feeling it runs a little bit slower than it's supposed to. That shouldn't be too much of a problem since the game is turn based, but it may get on your nerves.

Yeah, I suppose that there's not a lot of turn-based JRPGs slowdown would actually affect combat-wise. Maybe the Shadow Hearts series and a few others where timing matters, but not standard menu-oriented ones.

Fuck you Mark for allowing these stupid fucking weeaboos to use Holla Forums and especially allow them to take space on the catalog, for this I'd just go back to /r/gaming.
Enjoy your anime storytelling you fucking race traitors, it'll never be able to compare to WRPGs anyway.

I dunno user check out the embed that's where I got it from.

god I love Skies of Arcadia

Honestly seems like a shame that Sega hasn't made it more available. I don't think the Dreamcast original or the Gamecube port got very big print runs (especially if the current prices I've seen them go for lately are an indication; last time I saw the Gamecube version it was marked at $75 preowned and within days had been bought from the store that had it), and I'm pretty sure nothing's panned out in regards to those HD rerelease rumors.

This is the only game I ever shelled more than 100 buck on Ebay to own the collector's edition, because I fucking loved this game since I was 10.

Did the Sega CD version have a special boxed edition, or just the PS1 version?

I think only the PS and the Saturn got the special editions.

From a 2000 interview:

>IGNPSX: On a related note, Leo: Is he or isn't he?
>Victor Ireland: I personally think he isn't. But then again, I'd like to think Ricky Martin isn't either…

Leo confirmed for faggot by Victor Ireland's broken gaydar.

Leo? Like from Star Ocean? For what possible reason would he be gay?

Fuck me, I meant Lunar. Time for bed, I'm clearly retarded.

Good. I loved the game, but I don't see Sega not fucking that up these days.

God damn Vyse had some good waifus.

What does SEGA even do nowadays besides yakuza? The Miku games are done by someone else(no idea if they're owned by SEGA). They don't even make Sonic games anymore, really.

Supposedly it's one of the PC ports that we're still waiting on

Fuck Vic Ireland.

I'm not real sure they develop anything but that at this point. Looking at their still ongoing series, Sonic's most recent excursions have been outsourced, Valkyria's been developed by Media.Vision since VC3, Shining's also been developed by Media.Vision for at least a few games (not sure if they're doing the latest one)…

Who does development for 7th Dragon now, considering Imageepoch went under?

I heard about that. How on earth does he seriously think western fans having begged for new entries to come overseas are just being sarcastic and mocking of them?

Why doesnt sega just make like, one game to try and get their feet wet again?

I'm pretty sure Sega hired all the old Imageepoch staff. However the only thing I can find is 2 staff member who started their own studio and are making something called Earth Wars. I can't remember where I heard that Sega hired them.

I made thread for this earlier, but does anyone have experience with the .hack games? Which is better, the first 4 or the GU trilogy? Is the GU anime required viewing as I've heard?

SSF plays it fine. However, after beating it earlier this year I did have a few random crashes or the game would get stuck in a loop after a cutscene was supposed to transition to a boss battle. I forget how, but I remember reading elsewhere there's a setting in SSF to turn on/off to fix it. I can't remember right now what it was, I think it was the Check Idle Loop setting.

Sounds like you're using a PAL rip

Did people actually think Leo was gay? I always got more of a celibate priest vibe from him. Like he was so devoted to Althena that he had no time for anyone else.

Also, is there a way we can use this to make Ireland look like a homophobe to his little clique? Maybe make some Ben Garrison style edits or something.

I was pretty sure it was NTSC, but I'll check again. Thanks.

Who is this Victor Ireland guy? Is he part of that clique that started running a Japanese Indie Awards? Those people are awful they just hand out awards to white developers who happen to live in Japan and claim they're saving the Japanese games industry.

To my knowledge, Sega's never been the sharpest knife in the drawer. I mean, they can make pretty good stuff on occasion, but they also have made a lot of dumb decisions over the years.

I wonder if maybe the reason they haven't done much with Skies of Arcadia as an IP has been that they realize that fans hopes and dreams for something involving it might be too high at this point for anything they make to satisfy, even if an all around good game. And at worst, they wind up making something that fans hate to he point of borderline refusing to acknowledge that had no real reason to be made aside from riding to coattails of a well liked game (IE: Tales of Symphonia 2 generally being derided by fans of Tales of Symphonia for the Gamecube).

Not sure, since I haven't played Lunar in any form yet, but western WA2 fans used to think Brad Evans was gay for his friend Billy, but that was more due to the translation at times being hard to understand. I think the developers even had to say something along the lines of "they're not gay, just close war buddies."

Also, did Ireland actually say that?

Nigger, how old are you? Read up on the history of Working Designs.

Former president of Working Designs, and founder of their current incarnation as Gaijinworks. Likes to do localizations that are more rewrite at times than translation, complete with pop culture shit thrown in that makes stuff feel dated.

He's recently said that people that want accurate translations aren't who his company targets as an audience, defends NISA's choice to censor Criminal Girls, and says that he wants to get his hands on Idolmaster for western release but that they'd have to repurpose and/or censor shit because he feels the games are "borderline pedophilia."

Did Ben Garrison actually produce anti-Zionist cartoons?

I suppose not, but had to ask. Was wondering if maybe someone had done some digging for stuff he'd once said that he might regret if it got out there more.

Well he's an old localizer of course he thinks like that. It wasn't always their fault the tools and limitations they had were completely insane. However it seems like it isn't a new fad for localizers just to be failed writers who want to write their own shit without taking any risks and while erasing the hard work of someone else. The PSX days is really when that stuff started to turn around. Like the only game I can think of now that still does the complete over-haul is Pheonix Wright.

I don't understand these people if you find something morally reprehensible why do you want to take it and spread it around to more people?

Because money? But I don't get it either. Looking at NISA, their whole shtick has been "bring niche games west," yet their current way of doing things suggests that they hate the very aspects that make the games they handle niche to begin with hat it begs why didn't they just pass on the game in the first place and let someone else bring it over if they wanted to? I suppose with NIS developed games though they don't have a choice in declining to bring over if their parent company tells them to, and can lie their asses off to NIS about what changes "need" to be made for it to be sellable in the west.

I've heard someone say there's a valid excuse with Ace Attorney in that it would be hard to do the pun names for characters in English, but still treat the setting as Japan.

And this comes as a shock, why? Of course he'd target the people who, say, liked what they did with Lunar(though on his forums he claimed to have toned down the references in SN5). In other words, Gaijinworks is trying to create it's own nihe

As long as the games their company produces aren't censored i don't see a reason to care. Idolmaster wasn't ever going to happen, which is why he mentioned it over more realistic choices.

That, and the first game took place entirely in the city.

jrpg is dead, gaming is dead, user.

Next time he's going to ask "who is this Jack Woolsey guy I keep hearing from time to time?".

Fucking millenials, man.

That would be awesome. I like most of the games he worked so hard to publish, but I also like seeing people's reputations going to the toilet.

I'm pretty sure the only reason why NISA are doing Criminal Girls 2 is because NISJ are making the game. The only reason why they did the first game is because NIS got the rights from the game off of the dying imageepoch. I mean they put it out 2 years later and rushed it out the door. I bet NISJ started making Criminal Girls 2 and told NISA to get the first one out so they can sell the second one in the west.

As for Pheonix Wright I dunno it's tricky. They didn't censor anything right and the script has at least been cared for… aside from AA5. The anime is really aggravating to watch because I can hear all the japanese names but read the english names it drives me fucking nuts.

While what was done with Phantasia iOS made it into a greedy, money hungry piece of shit, to my knowledge, even the mobile reviews out here shat on it, claiming that this was how you took a classic game and ruined it with microtransactions. I'll see if I can find the one I'm thinking of.

Anyhow, funny thing about Tales and mobile: compared to other companies like Square, where they've done a lot of overpriced ports to it, Namco's only done that for two games (Phanatsia and Hearts R), with the rest of the mobile games being escort titles. If memory serves, they've said that the mobile games are meant to help get people into the series, and if they like it, they'll go and give the actual console and handheld games a try.

Not that that excuses Namco being greedy as fuck with DLC (and boy are they ever), but I appreciate that they aren't pulling a Konami and shitting on people that want games on console or handheld in favor of devoting all their effort to mobile games.

People tend to think that the "Grape Juice" is some kind of censorship for wine, but from what i've heard, it's always been grape juice even in the original Jap version.

Here's a screencap of the article in question (not sure about what sort of reputation Touch Arcade has, whether they're decent of Polygone/shitaku tier; I don't bother with mobile).

Also, another point to Namco: When Phantasia iOS failed out here, they didn't keep trying to push more mobile shit on us in the hopes that it stuck. Nor did it flopping kill the series chances for subsequent games coming west on consoles either.

Yeah, I can see how it would be annoying to try to watch an anime of Ace Attorney, especially if it's not likely to come west, leaving a dissonance between the Japanese voiced audio and English subtitled names. The way Tales of Hearts R stupidly had the protagonist's name changed to Kor in the west, while the audio still clearly calls him Shing.

Haven't really watched it, but do the subs use the american names? Kinda like how the guy who subs Game Center CX uses the localized names of games whenever possible.

I haven't watched it either, I'm just assuming off of what the guy I was talking to said.

It is really annoying in Hearts R though. Namco didn't bother with keeping 8-4 on as short a leash as they had prior (given that 8-4 had handled Abyss, Vesperia, Graces f, and Xillia prior) and let them run amok on a game they didn't want to bring west to begin with.

You mean console styled rpg? or light rpg?
Cause Jrpg doesnt mean a fucking thing you normal faggot.

It means Japanese RPGs, because those style of RPGs originated, produced and were popular in Japan mostly

No, you moron. And it won't actually gain anything productive, so trash it.

Ted, motherfucker. It's Ted Woosley.

I doubt the work load was too hard on him if he was bored enough to put all those references to Miami Vice and James Bond in those games.

currently playing wild arms, do you have to do all the stories at once or can I just play through as jack?

Fuck of Jfreedan.

So why did Sega stop having Camelot make the Shining games? Isn't that when the series took a turn for the worst?

Might as well ask here since its a JRPG thread. Theres a shit tonne of Lunar versions, which one should I play? I own a CFW PS3, a Saturn and a modded Wii (ie -Sega-CD and Megadrive emulation). Are there differences between the versions? Is there a definite version?

Whatever happened to the CEO of Imageepoch that disappeared?

Lunar Silver Star, I'd recommend the PS1/Saturn version, since it's the one with the Original voice actor for Ghaleon, in all his glory.

For Eternal Blue, there aren't that many options, so I'd go with either the PS1 or the Saturn versions also.

Shining Tear is a piece of shit, but I really love playing just for the satisfaction of clearing the maps overcrowded with enemies.

Triple A large budget JRPG in 2016? Keep dreaming.

Reddit please.

Sega CD has better music and the game/story is somewhat different from complete. For example; Random encounters in the SCD but in the PS1 version you can see and sometimes avoid enemies while Luna, your dedicated healer leaves the party before you and the fat jew can cash in the diamond in the SEGA CD version but stays for much, much longer in the PS1 port. The Saturn versions of Lunar complete have better music and FMVs, but never came out in America, partly because of some behind the scenes drama at e3 the year the game was suppose to come out, and partly because SoA's president at the time hated JRPGs and didn't want them on the saturn.

There's also a GBA port, which is a heavily butchured version of the PS1 game translated by fucking Ubisoft(and these fuckers couldn't handle a PSP port of a previously translated game without bugging it up) and PSP remake, but… i wouldn't recommend it. It just kind of ruins the magic of the original game, and the botch job done by xseed didn't really help matters.

The "definitive versions" though are probably going to be the "Lunar complete" ones for the Playstation

Victor Ireland is typical Western idiot who likes to rewrite Japanese games.

He's the enemy.

It's been awhile since I played the first Wild Arms, but I think you have to play through all three stories until the three characters meet up.

I'd recommend both the Sega CD versions and the PS1 versions, since they're all easy to emulate. They're almost like different games. Personally I prefer the PS1 version of Lunar 1 and the Sega CD version of Lunar 2, but you really can't go wrong with any of the console versions. Just stay away from any of the handheld ports of Lunar 1.


I can guarantee you I can recognise a JRPG on sight alone. There are things that will catch your eye. Japanese art style is a thing.

and this is why it's impossible to take weeaboos seriously.

Only morons. Victor Ireland might be joking, then again he's also still kind of a moron. Nowadays he seems cancer+moron, but back then he was mostly just a moron. Granted WD did set some good examples in terms of merch and feelies included and just the general sense that they genuinely like the games they brought over. But some of their translation and localization stuff was still cringe inducing.

That, and this is kinda funny since Lunar2 came out way before the current year craze of SJW. Leo was an actual white knight, and he white knights hard for the false Althena. He wasn't a bad guy, but he nearly got blinded and corrupted by Zophar Justice. He almost became a Zophar Justice Warrior.

"But what about mystere, isn't that a hint that he's gay?" Mystere is IMO, Leo's alter ego that was cheesy Tuxedo Mask style camp.

Nigger please. Americans still worship Working Design.

You're probably one of them.

He set a precedent. People WANT Japanese games without the Japanese stuff. Can't even be bothered to read subs. His style of localisation is still alive.

Lunar 1&2 is probably the best out of the bunch. The rest are eh, kind of curiosity at best but not really up to par compared to 1&2.
For Lunar 1 iirc the PS1 version adds more elements to the story vs segacd version. For Lunar2 on PS1 there are slight changes and some more cutscenes added but overall the main story is same as SegaCD version.

It's a mixed legacy. He does seem to genuinely like the games, in that era getting JRPGs for the western market SegaCD was probably regarded as dicey. Some of the game packaging like manuals and trinkets he could have done without and turn over more profits if WD didn't include them. But they did, because they're that fucking autistic about it, and it's hard to hate them on that part.

On the other, you are correct about the localization style. They were the 90's vidya version of 'the west won't read subs, dubs is the only way'.

>Americans shockingly don't like Japs with Jap related content
And you think Victor Ireland started this, which shows how much you know about even the most basic of history.

Wild Arms 1, 2, 3, and ACF all feature prologue chapters before the main story, in which the characters join up after a while.

Might as well post these as well for anyone else interested.

So to sum it all up: PS1 > Sega CD? Guess Ill delete my Lunar 1 & 2 for the Wii and add them to my PS3. Kind of weird theyd change the stories for the same game right?

Seen speculation of suicide or yakuza hit, but I don't think there's ever been confirmation. The guy's gone, either way.

As far as I know, Lunar 1 and 2 are the ones you want to play, though there's some variance in opinion over which version of each is best (I've heard something along the lines of PS1 for Lunar 1, Sega CD for Lunar 2, but I can't say from experience since I haven't played them yet). People do give the English versions some flak these days though, since Working Designs took some liberties, and there's no retranslation effort for either.

Avoid Lunar Dragon Song.

I've heard that Sega basically dicked Camelot over a bunch during SF3's development, though how I'm not sure. I think it was Sega was already focused on developing the Dreamcast and didn't bother to tell Camelot about it, leaving SF3 to flounder as the Saturn was dying.

Once the trilogy was finished, Camelot jumped over to Nintendo. Sega being the publisher of the Shining games own the rights to it, not to mention Camelot were originally a first party dev within Sega called Sonic Software Planning.

Supposedly a huge chunk of the first game had to be removed or changed for time, hence why they called the remake "complete"

Yeah it's weird. The packaging was great but they botched the translations.

Suikoden had a ton of grammatical errors, it's clear that some of it was done with an English dictionary. But at least Konami didn't rewrite or make stuff up for the West.

Which Working Design did all the time.

Oh? Were did I say he started it? I know full well most Americans don't like foreign media at all. Never have never will.

Though yes I'm too harsh on Working Design, they had to make money.

Have you played it already, do you care about spoilers at all? If so avoid the following, read on if you have already or don't care.

I wouldn't go that far with deleting. The basic overall stories are pretty much the same. ie, sega CD version of Lunar2 during the 'message from Althena' scene has Luna shown as still fairly young, at most ara-christmas cake 'old'. PS1 version showed old lady, pretty much granny age Luna. Sega CD Luna in that cutscene is shown to be a beautiful goddess like woman despite her wearing a simple dress, and IMO still works in the context since the player the plot at that stage is trying to find the real Althena. PS1 version shows a different POV or just fast forward the years to when Luna made the recording, to show what her decision to become mortal meant. But the main plot itself is pretty much same.

Basically above for me. PS1 Lunar 1 is pretty good. Lunar2, I like both PS1 and SegaCD, SegaCD has slightly better music version for some reason but I say that subjectively. I like the art style of PS1 Lunar 1. I still like the art style of Lunar2 on SegaCD, while the PS1 has more cutscenes and audio, some of the cutscenes are really quite good. Though not a fan of some of the 3D elements in one of the cutscene in the PS1 version. IMO the SegaCD version of that particular cutscene was far more menacing. ressurection of Zophar and Zophar vs Lucia scene

Instead, they butchered the hell out of the sequel, and were so incompetent they couldn't tell developer messages from parts of the script

Have to say I find it a bit odd that, despite their apparent issues with the translations, I haven't seen an effort by fans of the series to retranslate Suikoden I and II (it's not as if fans aren't willing to work with games in the series either, seeing as Suikogaiden I and II got fan translated). Same with Wild Arms 1 and 2.

I think the one example where Ireland did cop to being a regret in hindsight was a joke about Bill Clinton in Lunar2 segacd, and how a joke like that would age badly. Other than that, iirc he pretty much believed in the 'dub>sub' pov.

Yep the Working Design audience probably don't even give a fuck about the original Japanese game.

Oh no doubt the Suikoden TL is shit. But at least it's not rewritten/localised shit.

I want to experience the same game the Japanese get or I feel betrayed.

Came here to say that Final Fantasy 5 is amazing and the recent remake makes me sad inside

Considering the inconsistencies and liberties taken people have found in comparing the English and Japanese scripts for SN5, I doubt that's changed too much with him.

Anyone got that SN5 script comparison image about "daddy's getting mad" or whatever it was?

Final Fantasy V got a remake? Or do you mean a PC or mobile port with altered sprite work like Square's been so keen on doing?

IIRC there's also the GBA port that was translated by a goon or something along those lines(they also added SA memes to the game as well, supposedly.)

I hadn't heard anything before about goons having worked on Final Fantasy translations. Mainly just Pokemon and them having started to toss netspeak into the games, starting with the DS ones.

I've only played the Shining Force fighting games because I love fighters. What makes the other games so good for you and what's a good point to jump in?

Gotchu covered, oniifam.

I know the GBA FF4 port has Cid telling Cecil not to wreck his new airship up "something awful." It was pretty cringe-inducing.

Ah, I'd thought he was talking about the GBA ports of FFV or something.

As far as I've seen from Mato's comparison of the various versions of Final Fantasy IV, the DS remake, while flowery, apparently has the most accurate English script compared to the Japanese script out of all the translations and versions of FFIV available. Wouldn't shock me that the GBA version would have a poor translation, as I've heard all the prior ones have their own issues (including a fan translation or fan retranslation of the SNES original).

Problems, one of the SNES fan translations has.
Japanese language syntax, the fan translation tried to mimic.
Yoda-speak, the result was.

With things like Criminal Girls they're probably just getting them extremely cheap, because no one else even wants it. Reading in their forums the one guy who works there was hoping they could release it without censorship, but it sounded like higher ups were pretty much like "well you can't prove that there won't be problem, so fuck it all up". Even giving them a hard time for the alters instead of just removals of content.
It would be nice to see the company turn around, because games like Danganronpa show there is talent there, but I'd just look at it as Criminal Girls is one step closer to being playable in English for whenever there is a Vita emulator or CFW. The games don't really look so hot even if they were done right though, so I'd probably just pass regardless.

Isn't Criminal girls about doing really kinky shit to girls that look like they're 12 or some shit.

Reminder there was a third Lunar game and it will never ever be released in English.

Speaking of shit jRPG translations…

reminder that this game is what killed the real Lunar 3, if there was ever such a game in development.

Yeah, but apparently the people in charge made them censor it because they claimed doing sexual things to them when they're telling you to stop and are tied up and shit makes it have a chance ratings boards wouldn't like it. Changing it seems like it would ruin the whole premise since they're supposed to be in hell and getting punished. Plus, you know they'll start to like it eventually.

wait did wild arms have a bad translation? I dont know a lot about the series just started playing the first one.

To my understanding visual novels tend to be easier to hack text into (Text tends to be arranged pretty linearly internally with consistent boxes instead of being divided into dozens of separate places which if you're unlucky will have multiple different formats and limits) than jRPGs

Wild ARMS 1 is fine, but WA2 has some word salad. They did manage to properly translate the one really sublte line that spoil the entire plot, though, so that's good.

It was when Caina sad "our enemy is our finances" and then all of Odessa roflmaos.

If that did that sort of damage to the series, what did LDS do, double tap it?

Somewhat. Honestly, I wouldn't exactly call them downright bad translations (and some of the issues have a valid excuse, such as most of the stuff pertaining to Liz in WA2), and I myself found them understandable, but they have some notable issues that a retranslation could patch up (and hell, having someone/a group looking into the actual text between the Japanese and English versions would be interesting to see how much was really even caught.

Wild Arms PS1 misses some shoutouts and references here and there to things like Lovecraft (Alhazad should have been Alhazred), Ars Goetia (various monsters), and Norse mythology (Belselk should have been Berserk, Fenril Knights should have been Fenrir Knights, Zeikfried should have been Siegfried). Jack Van Burace is Zach Vambrace in the Japanese version (fitting his prior status as the knight of the gauntlet in the Fenrir Knights). Zed is… Zed, and I'm not clear on if he spouts the same incoherencies in the Japanese script (he does so in Wild Arms ACF as well, and that had a different, if perhaps not exactly better translation team), though his non-sequiters could easily be mistranslation if not how his character was intended as. There's also the fact that another particular name was mistranslated (I won't mention it due to spoilers), though I have seen some fans claim they prefer the mistranslated name as it keeps the reveal subtle. Wild Arms 2 has issues as well, though they strike me as much more an issue with a lack of editing to read better in English, as some lines did require multiple read overs for me. Granted, I can't exactly double check from the Japanese script since I don't know moon myself, but aside from a few instances, it seemed intelligible, if somewhat hard to actually read.

There's an interesting case to be had with Liz' seemingly gibbering lunacy. As far as I'm aware, he uses some very Japanese specific form of double speak (secondary meanings to what he says) or something that Ashley picks up on and responds in kind with as well, but the translators handled it literally. Though honestly, I'm not even sure if there is a good way that his dialogue could have been translated in a way that carries both what he was actually saying and his manner of speech in English.

Wild Arms 3 was the first entry to actually have a really good translation, courtesy of Squaresoft handling the translation work for Sony. Wild Arms 4, 5, and XF all had XSEED working on them.

Anyhow, the point is, they're not the worst translations around, but they could have done better, and a pair of fan retranslations could possibly help in the long run.

That's not Dragon Song.

Nothing, the damage was already done by the time that cash grab came out, and the people responsible for making Lunar good has already been sued out of existance.

Oh, a few more things that struck my mind. Wild Arms 2 does have a puzzle near the end that requires some knowledge about the origins of the names of the days of week, but the translation doesn't exactly help at hinting at that if I remember correctly. One of those puzzles where I don't think anyone will blame you for checking a guide. Probably the one time that the translation actively hampers progress (beyond needing to take more time to reread lines occasionally).

There's also some slight censorship in that Caina is infatuated with his boss (to the point he later goes full yandere vengeance mode when his boss is killed), who is understandably already interested in the girl on his team. The western version tries to claim Caina to be a girl at points instead of being a guy. The odd thing, though, is that there some other arts of the game that managed to remain intact for the western release, such as a fade-to-black sex scene involving Ashley and Marina, and another fade-to-black sex scene, this time involving cripple incest. The text on the screen makes it pretty clear as to what's happening even in both cases provided the player is old enough to get it, though you don't actually see any action. Just strikes me as oddly inconsistent that one thing got changed but the other (possibly even more prone to being censored/removed) ones didn't, but maybe it's a case where the translation being a bit hard to read let the sex scenes slip past unnoticed. Wild Arms 2 also was merely rated T out here; not sure what it was in Japan (provided CERO was a thing back then).

Saw someone playing a bit of I Am Setsuna.

Pretty standard JRPG, but the music pretty poor, and the UI hasn't been scaled up to bigger resolutions well.

Seems pretty good tho.

WA2 Retranslation project?

Honestly, part of why I don't think anything's happened for it or WA1 (or WA ACF for that matter; in some ways it fixes parts of the translation, but in other ways, Agetec dropped the ball; compare the demons "stealing the cocoon" to "stealing the arch"), is that the translations weren't BoF II-tier incompetent (which was made worse by the fact that Capcom just reused the SNES English script for the GBA port), nor were the games intentionally butchered like AT2 or Nep Rebirth Volumes 2 and 3 (fucking Doerr). Likewise, the series hasn't exactly been enormously popular, so demand for doing so might not be there for them. Though that hasn't stopped other retranslations for games with a niche audience, I suppose.

Oh, and as far as retranslation goes, there would be a few matters to also work out. Most importantly how easy it would be for someone to rip the actual script (I've seen some footage of the Japanese version, and some of the kanji seem rather cluttered at the PS1's resolution and the fonts sizes used, so directly ripping would likely help for accuracy a lot) so no lines of text, that are in the actual code anyhow (not sure if the pre-boss intros are tiny FMVs or technically in-engine), are missed.

There would also the question of what someone doing a retranslation should do with the opening FMVs for Wild Arms 2. The Japanese version of Wild Arms 2 uses lyrical versions of "You'll Never Be Alone" and "Resistance Line," while the US release (the game being never released in the PAL region) removed the lyrics and replaced them with a trumpet and more guitar, making the openings solely instrumental, much like WA1's is worldwide (even in Japan, "Into the Wilderness" has never had lyrics, be it the PS1 original or PS2 remake). I've seen some divide among fans over whether SCEA made the right decision or not.

One of main the problems I've had with 2nd Ignition was the font used for the text. It made reading what's going on quite a bit of a chore. Which was even worse when Class of Heroes 2 used a similar nigh-unreadable font, on top of all of the other questionable shit Gaijinworks did.

Oddly enough, it took Doerr making his own game to realize that maybe, just maybe, he was a bit of a fag regarding the Neptunia games.

I've been trying to get my sharp 86000 emulator to work but it has been in vain. Does anyone have any tips or links or guides how to setup sharp 86000 games (or PC98 or PC99 games for that matter)?

Found some cheap JRPGs I'd been meaning to look into while out earlier. Feels good.

I think I had more of an issue with the font in the first Wild Arms game than the second. But yeah, looking at some of it again, it does seem like the kerning was a bit odd, with some letters getting squashed rather tightly together. I'm not sure how much control they might have had over that though, given character/line limitations for insertion and such, compared to, say, a western developed game where the people making it also get to decide what to do with the text font(s), kerning, etc.

Has he actually felt guilty over fucking the scripts up? Like, actually admitted that was the wrong move? Unfortunate that after Rebirth Volume 1, a certain amount of vocal fans supposedly bitched to IFI about the game's localization lacking in the memes department, hence they'd hired Doerr to edit again.

So that's how far off the rails the Shining Franchise has gone, huh?

Shining in the Dark was initially a dungeon crawler of some repute. Finding a copy now is a damned chore, but it was fun. Shining Force is what basically kickstarted the fandom in the west—one of the first tactical RPGs with an actually nice story and great gameplay in a nifty animu style that wasn't played to hell since at the time you could rarely find art that made it to the US in one piece.

Shining Force 2 came along and blew almost everything about SFI out the goddamned water. And this isn't a "it made SFI look like shit" ordeal. SF just literally made everything better. Pacing, plot depth, quirky characters, battle mechanics, Nightmare Mode, the bosses, the weapons, the music—EVERYTHING.

But that's where the divide started. After the controversy around SFIII (at that point, there were 7 or so games in the franchise at the time), Sega and the remaining devs completely switched paces, turning the franchise into top-down or 3D hack and slash games, and bringing along "I'm as interesting as watching paint dry" Tony Taka to flagship the art & character design. Each iteration after that got weirder as Sega basically scrambled to find something that would stick, and fans in the east going "meh" (because they gave the west the finger after SF3 essentially, despite giving us Neo, Tears, and EX).

Shining Force
Shining Force 2
SF3 if you can find it
Landstalker (not a Shining Title, but the guys that eventually formed Climax Entertainment and Neverland Studios worked that game and it was fucking brilliant)
Alundra (same)
Shining Force Neo (If you can tolerate 3D hack n'slash
Shining in the Dark (dungeon crawling 101 stuff)

Shining Tears. Fuck the load times. You will spend most your time loading. Not worth it.
lol the rest aren't translated so no concerns there.

Reminder that Dragon Song/Genesis is what killed Lunar games. Also, you know, one of the two founding members of Game Arts and the driving creative force behind Grandia, Lunar, and so on dying in 2011.

8-4. 8-4 did the lifting there. Not all of the lifting, but it was theirs. That's what makes their shitty behavior on other titles even worse. They can do BETTER and yet they won't.

How are Shining Wisdom and Shining the Holy Ark?

Is Shining Force Neo more hack and slash than strategy, or a balanced mix? Just wondering since I saw a copy earlier.

Also, if mentioning Climax Entertainment and Alundra, it might be worth mentioning that they became Matrix Software and are still around, having made a number of RPGs and the like across the PS1, PS2, and DS. When they're not being relegated to Square-Enix's bitch to make mobile ports, anyhow. Hopefully with Omega Labyrinth they've gotten themselves out of that hole.

What did he die of?

Yeah, 8-4 did indeed do work on Wild Arms 5 and XF, but XSEED seemed to care enough to keep them in line and as such, WA5 has some content that likely might have otherwise been cut left intact, and I assume XF is fine as well (admittedly I still need to give it a go).

At this point, I kind of think it's really up to the company that hires them, and how much they give a damn about a particular game to not let 8-4 horse around much. If not, they're just a really fucking hit or miss company: capable of doing good work when they want to, but at times seemingly loathe to do so.

Oh, and on a related note, while I am certainly glad XSEED proved to hold them to a short leash (the way I suppose they later did with Carpe Fulgar being brought on to help translate TitS: SC, with Tom promising that they'd be double checking things to make sure they didn't pull a Fortune Summoners and try to fuck around; of course, if memory serves, the editor from CF still sperged out and delayed the English release long enough that the PSP version of TitS: TC can't be released in English as it's so late now), I'm happy they haven't felt a need to work with 8-4 since 2008 with XF; not sure how I'd feel about paying for something new from XSEED at this point if 8-4 was helping out, even if they still did a good job between both of them.

Hell, even Namco's seemingly dropped them from Tales localizations, though not before letting them botch Hearts R.

It's been a while since I played Neo, and didn't sink teeth hard into what it offered since the offering to my belief wasn't much. I'd have to go back to it full-force to give the detailed descriptor. It honestly wasn't bad, but I was also coming fresh off the GBA SF remake and wanted to know what a SF title would be like on PS2 without death-by-loadtimes. It was a disappointment. I'm sadder that SF2 never got ported elsewhere.

Never made public, iirc.

Had Sega outright considered Shining Force Neo a spinoff, or was it meant as an experimental main series title to see how something like that would fare with fans? Because with some series, it strikes me that too much change being tried with a main entry game risks a lot in possibly losing fans of how the earlier ones were, especially if it's not all that liable to pull in more than are turned away.

Looking at Square, while both games were indeed well received, Final Fantasy Tactics and Crystal Chronicles were still spinoffs that have since branched into outright subseries. And of course, they had other main series entries being worked on in addition to those. Meanwhile, with Capcom, Dragon Quarter was outright called Breath of Fire V in Japan, and regardless of how one feels about it (I know there's some mixed opinion on it), it basically got the series tossed in the freezer for over a decade until Capcom wanted something they could make a mobile game with. Probably would have been better received as an outright spinoff with something more inline with the prior four titles as Breath of Fire V having been in development alongside it.

It looks like Shining Force II has been ported to the VC and Steam, as well as being included in the Sonic's Ultimate Genesis Collection for the PS3 and 360. Or did you mean that it never got the remake treatment like Shining Force I did?

I'd personally recommend EXA over Neo. They're both departures from the game's strategy RPG roots, but EXA is at least slightly more polished than Neo.

I mean, unless you like hearing "HOT STUFF COMING YOUR WAY" three billion times before you finish the first dungeon.

As for Shining Force III, I'd track down the Japanese releases, since the (re)translation project covers all three parts. The US release only covers the first game (with Synbios as lead), more or less.

If you mean Sword of Hayja, then yeah that's on the eShop. But no other shining titles that I can remember. I missed the boat concerning Wii's VC—I thought it had already been shut down?

That aside, Shining the Holy Ark, Wisdom, Feather, Hearts, and several other titles all divert hard from the franchise's origins. Each game I mentioned is an entirely new and different way to play across several platforms (PS2, PSP, DS). Unfortunately, I stopped keeping w/Shining titles when Sega more or less let a few people make it crystal clear they hated the western fandom. So I haven't put stock in a game of theirs since learning that. Hence talk of a Shining fighting game being so damned weird to me.

Not sure. Latest things I'd bought on the Wii VC shop were Paper Mario and Super Castlevania IV a year or two ago. Haven't bought anything since as I don't want to be feeding NoA anymore, as I assume they get a cut of profits for hosting games on the NA VC. I would assume the games there have also been enabled for Wii U VC as well, but I can't say for sure as I don't have the system. Though, if you have a modded Wii, you might try asking in the share threads if anyone's got a link to VC dumps.

And yeah, it seems really weird that the guy currently in charge of the series apparently has such a hatred for western fans. Or maybe he might by chance get now that he was in the wrong, but won't admit to it and start letting them come west again.

I do suspect that Shining Resonance, or whatever the newest one is, would at least be a JRPG of some sort, given that's what Media.Vision does well with (though they've also been working on tactical games for Sega as well, like Valkyria Chronicles III and Azure Revolution).

And no, I meant the actual Shining Force II for the Genesis saw a Wii VC rerelease (along with Shining Force and Shining in the Darkness). That Hayja one seems to be 3DS e-shop only, and according to wikipedia, the Japanese 3DS VC also has Shining Force Gaiden and Shining Force Gaiden: The Final Conflict.

You are fucking morons. Kill yourselves.

Are there such things as MRpgs? DRpgs? Aussierpgs? So is every game with anime/manga based art style considered a "Jrpg"? What about Dark Souls? That is a western asthetic based game, made in Japan. Is that a Jrpg? Grow the fuck up and call it what it is. Steamlined casual trash so you can circle jerk about shitty attempts at REAL Rpgs. Get fucked, fucking weebshits.

What's yalls opinion on Grandia, specifically 3? I'm liking the battle system but the story is a bit too cliche for my liking.

Go make a fucking WRPG thread if this thread triggers you so much you nigger loving cuck faggot.

You mean a Crpg? you fucking moron.

Yes, WRPG, a term everyone uses but you and your autistic fat fuck buddy on youtube. Either talk about JRPGs or go back to sucking nigger dick while I fuck your mom.

I've generally heard good things about Grandia I and II, but not that much good about Grandia III. Take that with a grain of salt though and maybe listen more to some user that's actually played them, as the first two games are still in my backlog (and as of now the only version of Grandia II I'd be able to play would be the PS2 one which I've heard was a botched port; don't have a Dreamcast and my computer's a toaster I don't trust to be able to do that much in the way of vidya) and I'm not really inclined to go for Grandia III or Xtreme at the moment.

I do know that a number of anons consider the first Grandia game (and Skies of Arcadia as well) as a go-to if you want an adventure/exploration vibe-heavy JRPG.

I hear rumor that the PS4 is possibly going to be seeing a PS2 Classics digital rerelease of Grandia III, the way some other JRPGs like Rogue Galaxy and Wild Arms 3 already have. Going off of what I've seen in discussion before, I can't help but think that what series fans might be more apt to want would be a rerelease of the Dreamcast version on the PS3 and/or PS4 if possible, rather than a rerelease of Grandia III (or even a digital rerelease of the PS2 port of Grandia II).

Grandia II on PC (the remastered version) has pretty low specs, so I'd say play that version instead of the ass PS2 port.

How's the remaster fair with the original anyhow? Can't recall having seen much discussion on it since it released.

From what I've heard, it's almost exactly like the Dreamcast version. I think it had some bugs when it was first released, but they've supposedly all been patched out.

Any importers here? What games did you import lately?

Just finished Brave Fencer Musashi. What a great ride.

It was annoying at parts but goddamned awesome nonetheless
I'm tempted to try the sequel though I hear that S-E fucked it up HARD.

No you should kill yourself.

I could spot the Japanese influences in Demon's/Dark Souls art. Not my fault if you couldn't.

To be fair in the nineties there were very few RPGs made outside Japan on consoles. So I guess JRPG wasn't a term that was used much yet.

For me JRPG means a game made with Japanese aesthetics. Ignorant folks would say games like Dragons dogma or Demon's Souls look Western: they are wrong.

Yeah Grandia 2 anniversary edition is perfectly playable on a toaster.

The only thing that they couldn't fix is the soundtrack, it doesn't properly sync with the gameplay.


Reminds me I still need to give my copy of BFM more of a go, but my backlog's huge already. I honestly don't even remember how I got my copy of it to begin with.

The way I've heard it, JRPG and WRPG are simply regional classifications (IE: Japanese developed RPG and western developed RPG) as opposed to being directly about theme or gameplay, especially since you can essentially add further tags onto either of them (turn-based, real-time, traditional, strategy/tactics, X inspired, etc) as both cover a broad array of things, even if there might be stereotypes about the games that fall under each.

How much of an issue is the desynced soundtrack?

All these kiddie faggots who want to stare at a pathetic attempt at an "artstyle" is hilarious.

Seriously, you should all kill yourselves.