The Democracy Meme

How do we deal with the democracy/majority rule meme?

I was thinking about this today, and as an American, I realized that the bias was still ingrained into my own brain as well. I wanted to find a way to argue against it, to show that democracy and rule by majority have lead to our problems, but I kept coming to the same responses that I think the average person would have: "Just let the voters handle it. The majority can't be wrong."

What tools can we use?

Other urls found in this thread:

logicalfallacies.info
continuations.com/post/161938064520/getting-past-the-dominance-of-the-nation-state
reddit.com/r/DarkEnlightenment/
reddit.com/r/The_Alt_Right/
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francoist_Spain#Government
twitter.com/SFWRedditImages

Ask those who support it:
Watch the conversation descend into hysterics.

But possible counterarguments to that:

"Everyone. Just let (((everyone's))) voices be heard."
Even a hardcore liberal or conservative who bought into the democracy meme would just claim you have to let everyone vote and just campaign harder if you lose. They don't buy into ingroup thinking.

Look at the voting blocs by race. That's how you know democracy is fucked because people don't want what's best, they just want jew tribalism and gibs even if it destroys the damn ship called civilisation.

PLATO WAS RIGHT

No, tell them "you can't stop people from voting against their own best interests". Then the hysterics begin.

I think that might be a good first step. But the problem with that is, even if you get them to agree that people generally vote along racial lines, you'll still have to prove to them that those lines won't change. Look back to Jeb pushing to get the spic vote.

They'll be saying to bring in all the spics, "because if we can flip them, they'll all vote for us!"

Jews are 2%, if everyone really had a vote, they would be gone

They may very well not understand that these are just welfare leeches.

"Tyrone and Juan NEED that welfare money to survive! They're trying their hardest to make it big! Think of the long-term gains if we give them the support they need now!"

Funny enough, the (((Washington Post))) got it right.


Democracy only works when the public is well-informed of all matters being voted on, and representative democratic systems only work when representatives care about their constituents. When people are kept in the dark on everything, you can't count on them knowing what's best for them, and cracks form. When elected officials are allowed to do what they want without impunity or criticism, the system breaks. Combining these two scenarios creates the conditions that allows tyranny to breed in the background.

You want to fix shit? Fix the system?

>content of all bills an measures must fall within the purview of the name, and nothing may be attached or amended to a bill that is not related to the original bill tl;dr end pork barrel spending

Fix problems with the system by demanding that they listen to you. Do your own research and show everyone you know how bad everything really is. We have to educate ourselves, because they sure as hell won't help us.

only people who are legally employed and have no form of welfare AND can AND do show voter ID should be allowed to vote
in that case child support would count as welfare even if it already does

there goes 70% or more of the black and hispanic vote, as well as very very many blue votes

Who should be allowed to vote? Use this handy chart as a guide.

oh right
dual-citizens wouldn't be allowed to vote either

So you're saying the people of Britain were wrong to want to break free of globalism and Juncker should remain their king?

Just say "Imagine how dumb the average voter is, now imagine half of registered voters are even dumber!"

51% can vote to enrich themselves, by taking from the other 49%. Hence you could argue that it wold be good to both constrain and enrich this democracy by establishing some boundaries.

That sounds like an improvement from 1% enriching themselves by taking from the other 99%.

There's no way he'd get the spic vote by bragging about muh diking their goblin women. The only way would for be for him to be a spic himself.


Funny how the (((media))) tries so hard to shill the importance of the Jewish vote but during the election like 90-something %+ voted against Trump and they still lost. Not even spics voted that much against Trump. The Jewish vote is utterly worthless but on that just look at how elections are literally and openly in the media and by politics speaking about votes on racial and ethnic lines. Always the x vote and they away pander and pander away, positive policies damned. There has to be gibs to niggers, gibs to israel, gibs to spics, gibs to the AARP, gibs to veterans, etc. That's why democracy is a meme and it was observed in ancient Greece.

I've thought about this for a long time, and it's a hard subject. The kikes have memed long and hard about democracy being synonymous to good, and fascism being synonymous to evil. They have convinced the West that democracy is a constant for us, that there is no alternative. It plays well for their strategy to play both sides.
When you have unrestricted democracy combined with capitalism, you soon end up with political monopolies controling both sides, since money buys you media power, media power buys you political power,and political power gives you more money. And whoever gets there first, wins forever.
However there are few tenson points that we can use:
Everyone agrees that kids shouldn't vote. They shouldn't decide for a whole society what s best, they just don't have the knowledge. Then, you could force the oponent to admit that some kds are more intelligent and well-read then adults. So, you could employ a merit-based system, that the people who know best should be the ones with voting rights. Just like in ancient Greece, which brings us to the next point:
Democracy started in ancient Greece, where only the citizens could vote. This didn't include the slaves and the lower casts. You could also point out how democracy started a decline in many countries, like Poland, where only the noblemen could vote, but, they had a law called "liberum veto" which entitled the poor, bribed by foreign powers noblemen to stop any law coming into effect simply shouting "liberum veto!" and all the work done by honest men was for none. It's how Poland disappered from the map for 123 years. Those points however, are for limiting democracy, if you want to abolish it t would be harder.I've had an argument recently, and a person i considered wise said this about democracy >It's strength is not in electing the right person, but in making it possible to replace him when he does wrong.
From this we can see that democracy's goal s not the well-being of people, but in mitigating it's nad effects. We could turn this against them.
"The right people for the job!" - Could be our slogan. Instead of democracy's "If they do wrong, we can punish them." See the postive light ths shines on authoritarianism?
Besides that, wth the socialist tendencies of the intellectuals and some of the people, we could associate democracy with "rule of money". In contrast to our "Those who will do best will rule, those who love their country will rule". I feel as if this meme could do most damage, everyone knows that business and politicians rule in unison. Combine that with America going to war to "bring democracy" to other nations, leftist tendencies to hate the establishment, and you've got a new anti-democracy fighter

The media itself does more damage than anything else misinforming the masses. Look at the memes libabies think are true like the ridiculous shit about police purposely targeting niggers when actual evidence suggests otherwise.


Well both parties are Jewed to the 1%, even Dems moreso since Wall Str gave way more to Clinton and all the cocksucking she does to the banksters.

Raising the voting age to 30 would be pretty uncontroversial.

Yes, this. Another problem of democracy, the disproportionate power certain minorities can yield in their race to the newsreel and treasury. It's fucking ridiculous that 2% of the population can so regularly fuck over the other 98% of the country for their terrorist pariah state.

Work by the honest statesman is for naught.

All I'm just going to leave with is, if history repeats itself and it seems very much so, democracy is doomed as it was in ancient times. It may look moral and just, but even the selfproclaimed freedom bearers like America engage in deeply undemocratic actions since as what was revealed in the DNC leaks and of course its constant support of dictatorships and ruthless tyrannical monarchies like Saudi Arabia over legitimate democracies.

No matter how much one wishes to deny it, democracy is in fact a meme and history knows it. It will fall to the Romans grasping tightly woven sticks around their axe.

The gibs to niggers and spics eventually goes to jew landlords and supermarkets because they can't into capitalism. Gibs for veterans goes to drugs, the jews' second favorite form of control after the media. If it wasn't for a group of highly intelligent Supreme Court Justices, niggers, spics and jews would be killing themselves in their own designated areas of destruction.

america isn't supposed to be a democracy in the first place we ought to campaign against sufferage wwith the quotes shitting all over the concept of democracy for being a shit idea

you're an idiot.
that's a bandwagon fallacy.

You're a dipshit. Take five seconds and do your own fucking research.
logicalfallacies.info

Ive talked with several conservatives about this while working and moat of them agree that drugees and net tax beneficiaries should not get a vote. I really dont think it would be hard to extrapolate from that because brownies of any sort are likely to be exactly that.

Even 5 year olds, felons and the insane?

Bottom-right map could also read "As the Founding Fathers intended."

You're falling into the trap of caring what the majority thinks. Political systems are always created by a small group of competent and committed people who are willing to use force to achieve their ends. That's still the case: it's why lunatics like antifa get all their political agenda passed and have courts and companies side with them and cuckservatives are talking about arguments and discourse.

No, the reason why the antifa's "agenda" is succeeding is because its what (((they))) want. After all, those types of people were suppose to be the new vanguard of the "revolution". (((They))) still want the left to be that, and (((they))) have the power to make it seem like they are.

Easy. Boil it down to its logical extreme: If you go out for pizza with your buddies and they decide unanimously that you will pick up the tab, is that okay because it's majority rule?

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Came here to request that, thanks user, it never gets old

Bring up Socrates
People who care about an issue are more likely to act on it than those that don't. Laws are made that nobody really wants because a small minority of people started screaming about it.

democracy is an infringement on your right to self determination

Democracy got fucked when we gave women the vote. Just look at the quality of presidents we got once they were allowed in.
women are property nothing more!

Emotion, Money and Plurality (EMP); those are the greatest flaws of democracy.

Emotion: each and every government works under emotions, democracy is no exception, on the contrary, it's the government system where emotion is exploited the most. political candidates always use ( against each other) this as a method of bargain and manipulation, expecting that the masses react positively to their message ( for example; X is a big meanie, he wants to loosen gun control and allow psychopaths to brutalize your children! Vote for Y instead. Of course you might call bullshit on that, but what about the other weak minded individuals? Do you think they will react like you? Absolutely not. They will swallow the message and start reproducing it to other individuals, weak and strong minded)

Money: We live in a capitalist, liberal world. What does that mean? It means that now politicians can be bought by (((them))), for (((them))) only. Maybe do a couple of miniscule promises you made for the goyim, but the rest is for the elite. It's a pay 2 govern system , your vote ( nor your candidate promises) matter when the whole system is bought and controlled by an elite, if such candidate is not controlled, then the likes can simply pay the media some shekels to heavily slander the bad goy candidate and unanimously praise their good goy candidate. Remember that in a real democracy weak minded simpletons are the majority, and they will easily eat the bullshit presented by the mass media, the newspapers, the jewtubers, the actors from Hollywood, the singers, etc. If the method above fails, they will proceed and do something worse, which is rig the election, with their financial power.

Plurality: keep the goyim divided, and they will never unite against you. That should be the slogan of democracy. Pretty self explanatory, division is fomented on the core ( by creating multiple political parties, each with their "unique" agendas). People will never be united to fix the nation, there will always be an (((opposition))) that will slow down the progress of a nation. On a monarchy, fascist or national socialist government (or any half decent authoritarian government), the people are united against a common threat, and for a common goal. Something like that is impossible in a weak, democratic government, divided by their own opinions, nothing gets achieved

It's better to find another group of friends than to adopt a system where Soros decides everybody chips in to pay his bills.

We don't need more ruthless psychopaths like Hillary viewing citizens are slaves serving their desires. People doing something they are passionate about together is the best way to get things done.

I think that if you look at how democracy promotes moderate positions, and argue that moderate positions fail to solve problems you can argue that democracy is ineffectual. I don't believe that the pro-democracy meme can be fought directly, but if you force your opponent to concede the flawed results they will bend just enough to accept the merits of our position. I can't find my logh image where Yang says "the empire ruled by nobles is bad government, but democracy elected by the people governs badly". I know that is just a paraphrase

It's not that they're bad. He's saying they're incapable in democracy.

Better than the destructive positions we have now that destroy our planet and destroy lives in perpetual wars.

Yes. Thats why I said emotions are something that will always exist, in every government. The issue here is how the political (((candidates))) appeal to voters by evoking certain emotions that will guarantee their victory. Motivating people using honest emotions is a completely different thing from deceiving people to vote for you by manipulating their emotional weaknesses

Well, I think they're vital for accomplishing great feats like using tax dollars for research into curing diseases rather than expensive treatments or providing education on manipulative techniques used by con artists. I'm mainly defending real democracy, not representative democracy where the real problem is flat out lying like what Obama did.

Trump wouldn't have gotten elected if the people were that gullible. The media used every trick in the book 24/7 and he still won.

Jews need dumb goyim golums. Look at poverty pimping

Blackmail changes a lot of laws too.

How about we take it back to how it was and still should be. White male, Land owners(native white). This was a way better system. Only those of the correct ethnic class(white), being logically minded(men) and having a vested interest in where the country is going(Land owning, makes one want to do what's best for ones land). No dual citizenship too. if i had to compromise, id say the only requirement is land ownership, this basically cuts out any other ethnic class in terms of % held by whites, and snuffs women out as well

the 'tyranny of the masses' is the best argument against democracy i've come across.
It was a concept that was used to explain the Jacobin terror during the french revolution and of the dangerous aspects of democracy more generally. It is useful in this context for three reasons:

- It has legitimacy (to yanks) because it was expressed by founding father Alexander Hamilton (not to mention Ayn Rand, Robespierre and more).

- It has currency because it concerns the election of populist demagogues.

- It has importance because it is one of the major intellectual pillars used to justify the inclusion of a constitutional bill of rights and of the separation of state powers.

if some enterprising user can find a downloadable copy of the book 'Robespierre; or the tyranny of the majority' by Jean Matrat it would be a pretty useful resource.

pic kinda sorta unrelated

The masses are and always will be controlled by intellectual elites of some sort. Democracy is just handing over rule of the nation to whoever controls the minds of the majority.

It's not even real democracy. If you want to know what does the people think about a certain topic, what you should do is make a referendum, with simple options, were people would express their beliefs about a specific topic.
That's democracy, direct democracy where people express their opinion.

What we have now in most countries is "representative democracy", where you vote your favourite jew or good goy, and then proceed to be dissappointed by him for the next 4 years. After that, you get your opportunity to vote for the other party which surely has your best interest in mind.
That's current democracy. It doesn't work.
I vastly prefer direct democracy or authoritarism.

we should be thinking from the standpoint of a newly begun country anyway. not by "revolution" but by a Texas worth of land bought from some other country and inhabited by all of us woke people who want out

The point of democracy isn't majority rule, it's to dispose of shit rulers without resorting to violence every time.

Well Switzerland and Uruguay have governments closest to democracy right now. I haven't heard anything about Jacobin terrors there.

Democracy, where 51% tell the other 49% how to live, all to distract the fact that you're all being fleeced by IMF kikes as 'tax'..

CHECKED

Switzerland is the only 'true' government that is truly accountable as representatives, because as long as you have 100k signatures, you can change any law as long as it's not a breach of the peace…

Try doing that anywhere else it just gets shut down by some kike paid faggots.

Democracy is a good idea giving democracy to niggers women and other shitskins is not

Liberals have become more tired of democracy than you think. Both sides are starting to see it just descends into a divisive and exhausting shitflinging contest with nothing more than a sub-optimal compromise at the end.

But as for stopping it, let me put it this way. Democracy can never end democratically.

The issue of democracy is not even that it's a majority rule, or that dumb people can vote.

Problem is that it by default divides people in two groups around any generally irrelevant sensibility-based issue (muh abortion, muh fag marriage etc.) and creates discord even in homogeneous groups, like a line in the middle of IQ bell curve divides people into those of above average and below average intelligence.

Then the state essentially reduces itself to media rule, where different outlets appeal to different crowds, based on (in reality) irrelevant stances.

Democracy was never intended for the inferior. Start by analyzing its root, the city-state of ancient Athens. The vote was only granted to land-owning free Athenian men and only them. Women, slaves and foreigners, even the foreigners living in Athens who paid an extra tax just to be able to live there, didn't participate in any decision that required voting (and in many others as well, e.g. Olympic Games). As such, the voter base was well-educated, rational, nationalist and well-intended.
What's more is that these voters could throw out anyone they liked off their parliament by exostracism (meaning, they wrote the name of the politician they wanted exostracised on a broken piece of pottery and placed it in a big container. The one with the most votes out was banned from exercising politics).

Compared to this, the "democracy" we got today is totalitarianism mixed with 1789 French classical liberal "equality" BS that only works in theory. Fuck that.

tl:dr; start with the Greeks if you want to get a concise view on democracy

hell, even Rome who grant foreigners citizenship nilly-willy NEVER EVER let the novus citizens elect someone before proving themselves to be a superior man, a homo novus, to get into politics.
That's republicanism.
But yeah Democracy only works in a city-state where every citizens get the consequences of their votes ASAP. Or instant electronic referendum voting

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Thereby making congressmen fall asleep?

And that is why you should consider the poor oppressed minorities shitlord!

Most whites dont own land either and are stuck renting shitty apartments. See the song les degeneration by mes aioux.

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Sometimes I think it should be even more, maybe 35 or 40. That would be a damn good start.

Due to the agent-principal problem temporarily elected officials will always have the incentive to engineer the constitution of the electorate in their favor through gerrymandering, expanding the franchise and importing voters. We've seen this proces happen all over the world with very similar timetables.

The forms of government that currently exist in North-America and Europe have built in safeguards in their constitutions to make it difficult to change the franchise, to preserve the system. In these systems you need a majority to pass normal laws. Realistically speaking when you add a thousand voters their voting pattern wont be perfectly identical to the people that gave them the right to vote. So there will always be a half of the political spectrum that will directly benefit by expanding the right to vote. Outside of the political system there are wealthy widows, (((other influential people))) and corporations (cheaper labor, additional consumers) that may lack the ability to vote, but have to ability to influence elections.

You only need a single election where the franchise expansionist wing gets a little more than half of the vote and a few compromised people that rely on the strength of extrapolitical forces to get elected, to slide down the slope. Once the franchise has been expanded and immigrants have been imported it is nearly impossible to reverse this while playing within the system, due to the vested interest of these groups in keeping their rights and the politicians that depend on them on keeping their constituents. They are also likely to use their voting power to increase their economic and social power.

These systems are also very dependent on public opinion to get things right. Traditionally the primary organs for influencing public opinion are the press, the schools and the churches. If immigrants move into a political district, the children will have to go to schools. Primary and secondary schools tend to get funding proportionally for every student that attends. In some states schools that perform badly get additional funding. People generally will want to keep up on events that are important to them. Which events are important to you depend on where you are living. Immigrants may start watching television channels and reading newspapers, they wouldn't have read if they had stayed in their previous country. These media depend on advertisement, so every additional soul with a wallet that pays them attention is a win. Churches have similar incentives. Meanwhile the costs of these immigrants are socialized. Realistically speaking, the best you can expect of a major organ is indifference to immigration.

The organs of public opinion don't have an incentive to report accurately on immigration. If the people aren't informed correctly, politicians that have done their homework will have a hard time gathering the support to implement their policies. If a political system gets immigration wrong, then it may just as well get everything wrong, since this single mistake is sufficient to ruin it. Jeffersonian democracy and similar systems inevitably slide down towards full blown democracy. We need a system that doesn't have these incentives.

All it takes is 51 out of a hundred to take control. All it takes is 26 of the 51 to control the majority.

That's actually a really interesting point that shows how easy it is to subvert the majority. 100 becomes 51, 51 becomes 26, 26 becomes 14, 14 becomes 8, and so on. It's like electing a dictator, but out of a pool of 100 random people.

Which is fine because if the 49% really, really disagrees, they can move. This is what 3,744 people who earned 100,000 euros per year or more in France did in 2013 after tax hikes became unbearable. This is why a one world government doesn't make sense. War would be the only recourse because the 49% can't move to another planet.


The numbers don't improve in monarchies or oligarchies.


This is because the people don't have control over what issues get discussed. How many times did the amount of aid we give to Israel and Africa come up during the debates. They choose the emotional topics which will bring in the most donations. In a democracy, CNN would have been shut down by referendum by now.

I actually think this is a good measure. Not only it would force at least someone to pay a bit of attention to the whole thing, but it also slows down the legislative process enough that you don't have drastic changes all the time.

Here's what is talking about. What you propose would reduce the amount of retards with a vote but would still be shit (as what happened to Poland, see
).

Why does the catalog say there are 72 responses in this thread?

militarism and nationalism

Ah, now they're showing up. It was just 8ch reaching new levels of suck.

Man I wish more songs were this well-written. And it's in surrenderese to boot!
I wanted to say surrender monkey in French but Nigger Translate gives me "My God!" instead

Because the country was founded as a Republic not mob rule.

"I hear many condemn these men because they were so few. When were the good and the brave ever in a majority?" - Henry David Thoreau

When great changes occur in history, when great principles are involved, as a rule the majority are wrong. - Eugene V. Debs

"I'm not sure I want popular opinion on my side – I've noticed those with the most opinions often have the fewest facts." -
Bethania McKenstry

I think the most effective means of killing the democracy meme is to simply bury it under its flaws to the point that the person you are talking to is willing to consider alternatives.

Just have them recite the pledge of allegiance and let them btfo themselves. The USA is not a democracy, nor ever was.

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The people have little intelligence, the great no heart…if I had to choose I should have no
hesitation: I would be of the people. –Les Caractéres ou les moeurs de ce siécle’ (1688) ‘Des Grands

The people that walked in darkness have seen a great light: they that dwell in the land of the
shadow of death, upon them hath the light shined. –Isaiah ch. 9, v. 2

You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people all the time, but you can
not fool all the people all of the time.
–Attributed, in a speech at Clinton, 8 September 1858: N. W. Stephenson ‘Autobiography of A.
Lincoln’ (1927). Attributed also to Phineas Barnum

Democracy of whites would be great. The problem is low IQ races. They will only ever vote for gibs and fuck whitey. Democratic republics are probably the comfiest compromise.

Public school and media campaigns have shown free will to be a bunk concept as well. People who vote must live an unpolluted life of introspection and deep contemplation. TV watching plebs vote for whoever the talking heads tell them to. The other forms of government have too many drawbacks.

Plato promoted feminism. His noble lie is basically an early form of universalism and multiculturalism. Modern insight changes the way we look at people, so i don't think you can take him so directly.

…the earth, as being their mother, delivered them, and now, as if their land were their mother and their nurse, they ought to take thought for her and defend her against any attack, and regard the other citizens as their brothers and children of the self-same earth…While all of you, in the city, are brothers, we will say in our tale, yet god, in fashioning those of you who are fitted to hold rule, mingled gold in their generation, for which reason they are the most precious — but in the helpers, silver, and iron and brass in the farmers and other craftsmen. And, as you are all akin, though for the most part you will breed after your kinds, it may sometimes happen that a golden father would beget a silver son, and that a golden offspring would come from a silver sire, and that the rest would, in like manner, be born of one another. So that the first and chief injunction that the god lays upon the rulers is that of nothing else are they to be such careful guardians, and so intently observant as of the intermixture of these metals in the souls of their offspring, and if sons are born to them with an infusion of brass or iron they shall by no means give way to pity in their treatment of them, but shall assign to each the status due to his nature and thrust them out among the artisans or the farmers. And again, if from these there is born a son with unexpected gold or silver in his composition they shall honor such and bid them go up higher, some to the office of guardian, some to the assistanceship, alleging that there is an oracle that the city shall then be overthrown when the man of iron or brass is its guardian.

I think the Democracy obsession is necessarily tied to the American experiment. The handful of fascist-esque presidents (Jefferson, T. Roosevelt) worked within those boundaries of course. But if we go forward with secession, and the illusion of a single America with a single vision for government stretching back centuries will be shattered, and people will become for healthily aware of the alternative options fighting for exposure.

Fascism is the meme. Never works out. Centralized states are sluggish and abusive towards the people. Prussian education(all top down education for that matter) and centralized life kills the mind and body. You're left with a robotic population of dumbed down lever pullers who will not be able to adapt to a new problem. Their mono culture makes them all weak to a single fault. Decentralized, democratic states make best use of the naturally decentralized brain power in play.

Niggers and spics shit all over this. They push many people into a Spartan/centralized/traditionalist style government, so as to not let the surrounding degeneracy affect peoples' minds. Spartan structures are only as good as the guy giving commands from the top. Once niggers and spics get elected to positions of power, hell is raised on earth.

White people at least can choose to flee shitty areas in a liberty loving system. We're(Americans) destined to balkanize i think. That's not necessarily a bad thing. Certainly better than living under a centralized, spic run state like Brazil. Sooner or later the spics and nigs will outgrown their britches and start shit with the white neighborhoods. Then we will have our race war.

like all politics 'democracy' is a contested term. Is direct democracy more 'democratic' than representative democracy? Does an independent judiciary increase democracy even if they are not elected by the people?

When OP talks about turning a weapon against democracy, I presume that he refers to a modern western-style of democracy in which there is an independent judiciary, a constitution of some kind, and possibly 2 houses of parliament.

The 'Jacobin terror' was really the antecedent which defined 'democracy' as including these sorts of institutional checks and balances. This is from a time when the idea of unassailable human rights was new, as was the prospect of regular non-noble people being seen as equal under law.

This problem of the 'tyranny of the masses' is central to democracy because at its heart the idea that the majority of people can get it wrong. One implication of this is that the media is extremely important in making sure that people aren't stupid cunts and are equipped to make decisions which are in their best interests (it's where the media as the '4th estate' comes from).

A similar sort of problem is the 'tragedy of the commons' which is basically the economic version of the problem. It says that because normies are economically illiterate they will inevitably vote for the newest shiniest thing, even when that thing ends up fucking them over. It was used to justify things like privatization of public assets and neo-liberalism more generally.

tl:dr people are the best enemy of democracy. It's the whole reason meme magic werks

USA wasn't even supposed to be a democracy, but a constitutional republic. It kinda morphed into one, and pretty quickly too. I've read the founding fathers were disappointed within 20 years, chiefly because of the takeover of special interests, which is what they were afraid of. I believe their real hope was for the development and maintenance of a kind of statesmen class where would sacrifice a lucrative business or what have you career to take care of administering things for the good. It'd be quite a sacrifice too, since there was fuckloads of opportunity around that time too. I am paraphrasing from memory I'll admit, from a book called The Radicalism of the American Revolution. I highly recommend it. It talks about the democracy question in terms of early America a lot IIRC. It gives me a nostalgic feeling for the wildness of that period.

You transform and own it. No government can prevail without some homogeneity or some form of collective prospect and purpose. They want to dismantle everything, see continuations.com/post/161938064520/getting-past-the-dominance-of-the-nation-state
Democracy isn't majority rule, but rules of engagement to distribute power with involvement of the masses. Majority rule is bolshevism. Democracy is about finding compromises to stabilize its very own process. Importing shitskins to vote Democrats isn't stable at all, as is letting corporations dilute culture. Any actors actively undermining the democratic process must be shut out of it and be told in line.

I kind of have the same feelings as you. What may work in small European states might not in a continent spanning country that prides itself on movement, freedom, and rebellion. Strict adherence to the constitution, written entirely by whites for whites, could work maybe with a little nationalism thrown in to keep those who can't handle it or want to subvert it at bay. Is there such a thing as constitutional nationalism? Meaning I guess enforce the original constitution under threat of death. We could also cut away a couple of newer amendments too, and reaffirm states and local government rights, which should be fucking sacred. I'm not a liberal shill. It's just USA is not Germany. I think their Furher himself would even understand.

Even if it isn't exactly majority rule, isn't it hard to keep it from being subverted by special interests? How could a country counter that?

How could the constitution be amended?

It's already been amended many times. I'm saying we could even do the opposite and cut some. It's meant to be altered, even if it's an arduous task. Our problem is our leaders and judges don't give a flying fuck about it anymore. I'll bet many politicians don't even know what it says. Civics is not taught anymore. Nobody thinks it's worth making their kids take it when it takes time away from studying for future college. Another way education prevents learning. This is what my mom says as she's on a school committee. Nobody knows how the country is supposed to work anymore.

reddit.com/r/DarkEnlightenment/

reddit.com/r/The_Alt_Right/

>For Aristotle, Democracy is possible only within homogeneous groups, while despots have always reigned over highly fragmented societies. A diverse society is thus necessarily anti-democratic and chaotic, for it lacks philia, this profound, flesh-and-blood fraternity of citizens. Tyrants and despots divide and rule, they want the City divided by racial rivalries. The indispensable condition for ensuring a people's sovereignty accordingly resides in its unity. Chaos from diversity prevents all philia from developing.


And now you understand what is happening in the West and the nature and plans of the elite

If democracy actually was majority rule, it wouldn't be a bad thing. After all, as every serious poll proves, the majority dislike immigration, globalism and all that shit.

Problem is that democracy isn't majority rule at all but minority rule. Codreanu, Spengler and others have already explained it all much better than I ever could so I'll leave it at that.

Democratic society is falling apart like Rome's and the leftist idiots are already making Trump assassination plays where he's Caesar without realising the irony and consequences.
Why is democracy a meme? Because of the nature of the conflicting nature of interests like Plato's Ship of State.

Democracy only worked when global economy never existed and news passed slow.

Modern democracy is electing who will bend the knee to the economic kingdom floating above all our heads ready to strike us down if we disobey.

haha that's just epic man.
Burgers are fat and stupid ! Haha man the memes.
Christians are pedos !
God I sure love kocher maymays

"The majority supported Hitler."

I've thought some about this. If you want to actually preserve a constitutional republic and maintain a semblance of democracy you need to severely limit the ability of the citizenry to vote. Nothing about the word "democracy" implies that the society practicing that form of government ought to extend suffrage universally. Thus, when I consider what must be done to rectify the excesses of our current state, I arrive at one solution which I believe will sort things out for the better: a "one household, one vote" rule. In other words, no citizen who is unmarried will be able to cast a vote; families will be the ones casting votes rather than individuals. This would help to bring the family unit closer and would separate the disinterested from those who actually wish to participate in the society at large (the desire to start a family the primary criterion by which this desire is measured). This cleverly circumvents any criticisms of sexism (ie no female suffrage), since women would not be prohibited from voting; rather, each family would elect one representative to cast the vote for that family. In some years this may be the husband, in other the wife, according on the peculiar circumstances of the family in that given year. Whether or not the woman bends to the will of the man in a private matter in this regard; and vice versa, for that matter.

Regardless of age, sex, race, etc, if you are unmarried and are not actively working to support the country by means of starting a family, then you will not be allowed a say in the affairs of the state. This would give an incentive to marriage which I believe is lacking at present. Further, it could even be argued that families which have not had children should also not be allowed the vote. But some women and men are infertile or sterile and ought not to be punished for the cruel hand fate has dealt them.

The fewer people who are voting, the more information can be thoroughly disseminated throughout the voting bloc and the better it can be assimilated into that body. Therefore better decisions will be made by the citizenry. Of course, there have to be other safeguards against mob rule on the part of the public and oligarchy on the part of the elected officials. I happen to think that the US's diffused and representative version of constitutional government, with officials at several levels from local to federal, and with certain checks among the trifurcated federal system provide the best solution for this problem, but I'm sure there are other policies one could enact to better protect the nation from special interest groups (term limits, lobbying restrictions, etc).

Democracy is OK, it's universal suffrage that's the problem.

Good post.

Something else to consider which kind of answers the OP's question: referendas are arguably the most useful thing in democracies, far more useful than voting for MPs (which then do whatever they please). Even most of the diehard libtards would agree with this (but not the libtard elites).

Here's the kicker though, referendas do not require a democracy in the first place!

You can very well hold a referendum in a fascist country. Franquist Spain held referendas all the time. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francoist_Spain#Government

Very, very important!

REPUBLIC!

nigger, half the literature and papers written in the founding of the country talk about how democracy is dogshit, anyone who talks about america ever being about democracy is either a moron or a (((talking head))), if america was about democracy, there would be no electoral college, representatives, no supreme court

werent jacobins democratically voted out of power?

Rejecting anti human governemnts would be a start.

I think a well informed and logical population could govern itself. But the media and education system are 100% controlled by our ideological enemies poisoning the minds of our people.

I would submit to being ruled by a logical artificial intelligence who can see through all the Jewish lies.

not my brother

Information is the raw material of modern warfare, and it is no coincidence that good political analysis which strays from popular narratives are nearly impossible to find. In this sort of situation (where all news is 'fake', and education is simply a tool used to reinforce corporate agendas) direct democracy is almost useless because the vast majority of citizens flat out have no idea what is really going on, and the few who suspect something else is happening behind the scenes have no reliable sources of information to investigate their suspicions and to discover their true political identity.

I think delegating the work of politics to ministers (rep. democracy) is one attempt to address this, but even this can't work without voters' trust. Deliberate misinformation campaigns and just the ugliness of politics in general means no one trusts politicians anymore, which makes the role of media EVEN MORE important. This conception of democracy is in a death spiral. More info makes it harder to separate fact from bullshit, this makes the job of media more important, which creates more info… and so on.

Maybe some kind of disinterested and super intelligent AI will break us out of this cycle.
Feed in a bunch of social development indexes into that as axiomatic truths, and then let this super computer set the agenda of which issues are urgent and need to be addressed. Voters would then weigh in democratically after the agenda has been set algorithmically.

The purpose of democracy isn't to have every voice heard or to make decisions as a group - those are ideals that can happen but aren't the core of the system.

The purpose is to change the ruling elite without bloodshed. Now ask yourself: are we still able to do that? Trump won DESPITE the system, not because of it.

Keep winning elections against the Left.

It all really depends on who is voting. The Irish shit everything up in the US.

I have long advocated for a system like this except the dual citizenship is too obvious (((they))) will fight it too much, and a few add ons.

Pay congress and house members like a shitton. Say $5 mill a year or so. Give them a hefty retirement also. The downside is they can never ever ever work for anyone, own a business, consult for pay, or own stocks during or after office. Also extend this to immediate family working for any institution which could have had contact lobbying (within reason). You become a senator, you are done. Everything you do after is for the country or charity. The money spent would be a negligible amount compared with what we spend now.

It would also help the state level governments to run as they now stand. Anyone not aspiring to congress in some fashion would be suspect within a few years.

Set up a navigable database which is very normie friendly with bills, who voted, state AND federal budgets down to even the smallest reasonable contracts (100k total or so). It would entail a lot of work but the money spent would ensure both a more informed citizenry and the ability for the citizens to effectively regulate much of the waste. This database should also include searchable links for state/federal statistics and studies.

This would completely fuck over the people in Washington who are professional politicians and not legislators.

Add in a national voting registry with Social Security purging dead people. Scanable prior to voting and a must present Birth Cert and Picture ID to get initial national card. Make them for life and give some funding for "free" signup so he nogs cannot beat the wr drums too hard. It gets rid of the illegal bullshit once and for all.

Going to hell for the doublepost but it's a fix it package for the moment.

Call them illiterate plebs for not knowing that Plato debunked it as a forced meme 2.5 centuries ago.

That mentality is everything that's wrong with the modern white man. If criminal nogs set up in your neighborhood and politicos squeeze you for blood on behalf of their pet parasites because muh democracy, if your local shops turn into fortresses with transient flocks of spics–don't worry, there's always somewhere to run away to!

i am shocked than i cannot find a post telling this simple truth

the founders of america fucking hated democracy
the only reason the built the federal gov was to avoid mob rule
this is a == constitutional republic ==

go molymeme 'argument over' route
or point out it leads to communism per hitler or is a form of it per hoppe

or just laugh at them

Survival must come first. Democracy gives our enemies power over us. What kind of faggot thinks that's good?

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sure this would maybe drive the birthrate up but what makes you think that voting in families would solve anything? Sure it raises automatically the voting age but I believe you would gain far more people favourable of socialism.
Imagine who would be able to participate in the voting body faster;
Somebody who finishes various degrees after high-school, gets a well paying job and then maybe establishes a family.
Or somebody instantly joining the workforce at a low-end job.
Here in Germany you have Muslims marrying as early as 18, because of their arranged marriage bullshit. This is also a factor how minorities with their nepotist nature could gain more from this.
Giving one vote per family does not raise the intelligence or whatever we wish to archive, it creates tensions between family member who would prefer to vote for different parties or makes them more susceptible to manipulation by each other.It does however keep out fringe groups out of the voting block, retards, gays and the socially inept. This is all very hypothetical but voting truly needs some reforms.

I simply say that this is a Republic and that Democrats are guilty of treason. I don't really give a fuck if people can handle that or not.